1 00:00:07,419 --> 00:00:15,469 *35C3 preroll music* 2 00:00:15,469 --> 00:00:25,910 Herald-Angel: So, congress isn't only about techy meet ups. It's about 3 00:00:25,910 --> 00:00:32,960 personality. It's about humans. And what happens when block chain and social 4 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:38,800 connection meet each other and have a baby? Well, Scuttlebutt: the decentralized 5 00:00:38,800 --> 00:00:45,421 social network may result. And Zenna or zelf will introduce Scuttlebutt to you. 6 00:00:45,421 --> 00:00:48,620 Thank you very much. 7 00:00:48,620 --> 00:00:54,290 *Applause* 8 00:00:54,290 --> 00:01:03,889 Zenna: So, hello! I'm Zenna or more maybe known in Scuttlebutt as zelf. That's my 9 00:01:03,889 --> 00:01:07,830 profile picture. I'm not just trying to put anything out there. *laughing* 10 00:01:07,830 --> 00:01:13,619 But yes, I'm zelf or Zenna and I've got a background of seven years in digital 11 00:01:13,619 --> 00:01:21,340 fabrication / the fab lab scene and I'm a grant writer for Scuttlebutt. That's why 12 00:01:21,340 --> 00:01:27,340 I'll be talking about Scuttlebutt today. So I'll take this off. Because it was 13 00:01:27,340 --> 00:01:32,650 making noise. So what's Scuttlebutt? Can we get a really really quick, how many 14 00:01:32,650 --> 00:01:39,520 people here have heard about Scuttlebutt before? Eeey, that's a few, that's pretty 15 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:45,289 good. Okay. Second question: how many people got on Scuttlebutt? Okay, that's 16 00:01:45,289 --> 00:01:54,909 not all of you. Those of you who had heard about it but didn't get on: Uh, uh, mm. 17 00:01:54,909 --> 00:02:01,890 And yes. So the rest of you, we'll be telling you what Scuttlebutt's about. So, 18 00:02:01,890 --> 00:02:06,179 Scuttlebutt, it's a really strange name right? It's like the first reaction 19 00:02:06,179 --> 00:02:13,970 everyone has. So Scuttlebutt, originally, it's a sailing term for water container. 20 00:02:13,970 --> 00:02:22,430 It's slang for gossip, which is also why Scuttlebutt is created... whoops, is 21 00:02:22,430 --> 00:02:30,080 called the gossiping protocol. So, Scuttlebutt was created by Dominic when he 22 00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:34,650 was living on a boat and he was like "Huh, I'm living here on a boat, but I want to 23 00:02:34,650 --> 00:02:40,659 talk to all my friends. What should I do? Well, I'll build my own protocol." Of 24 00:02:40,659 --> 00:02:46,760 course that's the first thought everyone has, right? So he did. And Scuttlebutt 25 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:56,780 was born. So it's a peer to peer gossiping protocol. So, some of you might be curious 26 00:02:56,780 --> 00:03:04,220 what specifically is that? It's not a centralized system. Most people here 27 00:03:04,220 --> 00:03:11,810 should recognize this casual one. Actually, oh wait, let me check it. Yeah. 28 00:03:11,810 --> 00:03:20,400 Okay. Good. It's more like, whoops, double, this. So, it's a distributed 29 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:27,080 network with... distributed not decentralized, if anyone cares about that 30 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:37,739 difference. Or this, which is by the way a picture of Andre Staltz actual network. 31 00:03:37,739 --> 00:03:45,760 And this is a picture of mix's network. Simply put, it's kind of like this. You 32 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:51,219 got your friends. You got your friends' friends. This you can see and you can 33 00:03:51,219 --> 00:03:59,340 store on your computer, then you got your friends' friends' friends. This you can't 34 00:03:59,340 --> 00:04:07,790 see but you can store, except if you're using patch bay then you can also see it, 35 00:04:07,790 --> 00:04:14,540 but yeah. *laughing* And beyond! Which you don't even know 36 00:04:14,540 --> 00:04:25,320 exists. So, that's how we communicate. So, to point this out, this also means that no 37 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:30,540 one else knows you exist, which makes it very difficult. Approximately right now 38 00:04:30,540 --> 00:04:40,970 we're around 10000 users on Scuttlebutt. The thing is... Afterwards! The thing is, 39 00:04:40,970 --> 00:04:45,630 we're not sure that's the exact number because it's impossible to actually be 40 00:04:45,630 --> 00:04:52,210 able to tell how many people are out there. Do you really want to... okay, 41 00:04:52,210 --> 00:04:59,800 okay. So, this means there can be communities using these in a mesh network 42 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:08,580 village somewhere, for example, or it could be something else. And that's like, 43 00:05:08,580 --> 00:05:16,611 physically impossible. Like, it's not possible with the protocol. So, that's 44 00:05:16,611 --> 00:05:23,100 like the basics of it. But there's also pubs, and pubs are basically – OK, what if 45 00:05:23,100 --> 00:05:26,080 I want to know more people than the people who are within my friends' friends' 46 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:31,300 friends' reach, you know? What if I want to know someone else who deals with 47 00:05:31,300 --> 00:05:38,280 shrooms? Not shrooms, mushrooms. As a shout out to gliph out there, who does 48 00:05:38,280 --> 00:05:44,720 that. Then we got pubs. And pubs is a very, very great analogy is actual 49 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:49,720 physical pub. So you go there. You meet some people that are outside of your 50 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:53,530 friendship circle. You talk, you hear their gossip about their friends that you 51 00:05:53,530 --> 00:06:01,330 are not connected to. And you tell them your gossip about your friends etc. And 52 00:06:01,330 --> 00:06:06,330 essentially, the Scuttlebutt protocol is very much replicating how real human 53 00:06:06,330 --> 00:06:11,340 interaction actually happens, rather than a centralized system which would be more 54 00:06:11,340 --> 00:06:16,300 like: Huh, I take everyone's data, and then I tell everyone what they need to 55 00:06:16,300 --> 00:06:25,410 know, sort of very generalized. OK, so there's a few quirks with Scuttlebutt and 56 00:06:25,410 --> 00:06:33,410 similar kind of protocols sometimes. So there's communal data privacy. It's 57 00:06:33,410 --> 00:06:37,550 impossible to see others data unless they are in your network proximity. That's what 58 00:06:37,550 --> 00:06:43,400 we mentioned previously, right? You've got offline usability. So this is one that 59 00:06:43,400 --> 00:06:47,170 surprises most people because most people think: Internet, huh, I need a connection. 60 00:06:47,170 --> 00:06:53,740 Well, you don't! So it's completely usable in mesh communities and over, for 61 00:06:53,740 --> 00:07:02,490 example, Sneakernet. And third quirk: You've got free listening. This is more of 62 00:07:02,490 --> 00:07:08,030 a design quirk but it's still one that's very important, I think. So rather than a 63 00:07:08,030 --> 00:07:15,060 top down censoring, there's a choice of blocking. So you can choose to not listen, 64 00:07:15,060 --> 00:07:24,250 rather than removing/revoking someone's right to speak. Then we got the fourth 65 00:07:24,250 --> 00:07:31,370 quirk which, yeah, it's in the air a little bit, but it's hardware bound. So 66 00:07:31,370 --> 00:07:36,010 the SSB accounts are tied to the device they're on. No passwords and more 67 00:07:36,010 --> 00:07:43,910 difficult to swarm, which, mmh, yeah, it could be discussed, but still it's 68 00:07:43,910 --> 00:07:49,410 hardware bound, so no passwords which currently means, if you have an account, 69 00:07:49,410 --> 00:07:52,524 you can't like log in with the same account on mobile and then use it on your 70 00:07:52,524 --> 00:07:59,280 computer as well. You have to have like two different ones. Yes, what if you loose 71 00:07:59,280 --> 00:08:06,340 your device though? If it's hardware bound, that sucks! This has happened to 72 00:08:06,340 --> 00:08:14,660 me. So that's where Dark Crystal comes in, and I hope Dan is OK with this because 73 00:08:14,660 --> 00:08:21,660 we've done this before, but he's going to explain a little bit about Dark Crystal. 74 00:08:21,660 --> 00:08:27,630 *laughing* Dan: *incomprehensible* ... technologies 75 00:08:27,630 --> 00:08:35,130 is the assumption that the human or machine or entity interacting 76 00:08:35,130 --> 00:08:45,529 with the protocol is the sole custodian of a private key. Try and imagine something 77 00:08:45,529 --> 00:08:49,980 really precious which if you lost it you would lose access capacity and 78 00:08:49,980 --> 00:08:55,520 affordances. So I'm not talking about a passport or a bank card. Those things you 79 00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:59,990 can go to a central authority and you can replace them. If you lose your password to 80 00:08:59,990 --> 00:09:04,860 Facebook, you could go through some process, such as showing them an identity 81 00:09:04,860 --> 00:09:09,690 card or some other identifying feature which they would determine binds to you, 82 00:09:09,690 --> 00:09:14,930 the human, who is the owner of that account. In peer to peer systems, there is 83 00:09:14,930 --> 00:09:23,269 no company, there's no central authority to whom you can go and jump through 84 00:09:23,269 --> 00:09:33,550 whatever process to regain access. So if you lose your private key, you are screwed 85 00:09:33,550 --> 00:09:40,090 in peer to peer world. This is your digital identity and if you lose it you're 86 00:09:40,090 --> 00:09:47,360 screwed. That's very fragile. Password managers are hard. About 17 percent of all 87 00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:53,730 bitcoins which will ever be minted, have statistically look like they've been lost. 88 00:09:53,730 --> 00:09:58,639 If you literally can't pay people to keep this stuff secure, I think it indicates 89 00:09:58,639 --> 00:10:03,740 that it's a right problem to solve. And that's really what we've been working on 90 00:10:03,740 --> 00:10:10,290 with Dark Crystal. If you're a Harry Potter geek, think Horcrux. If you're not 91 00:10:10,290 --> 00:10:16,059 a Harry Potter geek, it's a mechanism which leverages human relationships and 92 00:10:16,059 --> 00:10:22,939 trust, and you weave a spell saying of my five friends, let's say my mom, my dad, 93 00:10:22,939 --> 00:10:28,100 two brothers and my best friends. As long as three of these people out of the five 94 00:10:28,100 --> 00:10:37,399 confirm and grant me access, then you can regain the original secrets. In this case 95 00:10:37,399 --> 00:10:41,920 it might be a private key, without themselves holding the shards, the piece 96 00:10:41,920 --> 00:10:50,269 revealing anything to them. So it's pretty exciting. Hope that helps. 97 00:10:50,269 --> 00:10:59,540 Zenna: Thank you Dan, who is right here actually. No? Oh that's right, 98 00:10:59,540 --> 00:11:02,029 sorry about that. Dan: *incomprehensible* 99 00:11:02,029 --> 00:11:04,119 Zella: You're what? Dan: *incomprehensible* 100 00:11:04,119 --> 00:11:09,579 Zella: Okay, *laughing*, another Kiwi that was. I have yet to actually 101 00:11:09,579 --> 00:11:13,130 meet Dan in person. And there's a lot of people out here that 102 00:11:13,130 --> 00:11:18,889 is like the first time we meet because we work online only. So it's pretty exciting 103 00:11:18,889 --> 00:11:24,449 to be here. We like running around scouting, who could be that person on 104 00:11:24,449 --> 00:11:33,660 Scuttlebutt? Um, yes. This is Dan. He's the founder of Blockades, an acclaimed 105 00:11:33,660 --> 00:11:42,920 crypto guru. So, how do I use Scuttlebutt? The actual usage of Scuttlebutt could look 106 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:50,060 like this. This is patchwork. Patchwork is the recommended one to use once you start 107 00:11:50,060 --> 00:11:55,920 using Scuttlebutt. But there's many other. Because remember, Scuttlebutt is only the 108 00:11:55,920 --> 00:11:59,829 protocol, and then you can place many different interfaces and applications over 109 00:11:59,829 --> 00:12:07,059 it. So you got Manyverse, which is a mobile client which André Staltz released 110 00:12:07,059 --> 00:12:15,270 like two months ago. And we got Patchbay which Dark Crystal currently is being run 111 00:12:15,270 --> 00:12:26,170 via. And it's more experimental, easier to change than Patchwork. And TickTack, which 112 00:12:26,170 --> 00:12:31,160 is like a blog stylish. And then you got more specialized applications because 113 00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:35,740 obviously you don't only have to use like a social media interface. You could also, 114 00:12:35,740 --> 00:12:47,570 for example, play chess. That's you! Eyy! Hello by the way. *laughing* Or, you can 115 00:12:47,570 --> 00:12:54,699 make book reviews applications, or skill sharing applications. And it goes on and 116 00:12:54,699 --> 00:13:02,480 on and on. Pretty much anything that has to do with connections between people. So, 117 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:09,760 this is where we get to the second part. How does Scuttlebutt fit into the future? 118 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:18,589 Ooh, what a yummy question. Before, oh, did I not add that? I had this gif. Is 119 00:13:18,589 --> 00:13:25,720 that coming soon? Right. Yes. OK, let's just jump to the gif because it's fun. 120 00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:30,509 Let's do the wave before because we're gonna get like shifted a little bit. Now 121 00:13:30,509 --> 00:13:33,899 you've heard about Scuttlebutt. You know what it is. Now we're going to kind of 122 00:13:33,899 --> 00:13:40,720 talk about like more futurists. So, could we try out quick wave starting from over 123 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:47,760 there, spreading downwards, going up here, spreading backwards? Is that possible? Are 124 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:53,699 you guys capable of this? Yes? Yes?! Are you down? That person over there, stand up 125 00:13:53,699 --> 00:14:05,229 if you're ready! Wooooh, OK, let's go! OK, we got it, ready. OK. It's somewhere 126 00:14:05,229 --> 00:14:19,639 goiiiiiiiing. *laughing* Good job people! OK, so instead we'll go back a bit, 127 00:14:19,639 --> 00:14:24,790 because we're switching. We're talking about the future and we're talking about 128 00:14:24,790 --> 00:14:37,179 solar punk. So solar punk is a common futuristic approach. It started as a sci 129 00:14:37,179 --> 00:14:45,430 fi genre which many people in this kind of community also very much enjoys. It's a 130 00:14:45,430 --> 00:14:52,650 way of looking at how we can shape the future. And it's also an aesthetic, or 131 00:14:52,650 --> 00:15:06,610 guess sometimes. So there are very, very many different views of how the future 132 00:15:06,610 --> 00:15:12,300 could be. So I'm talking right now, so obviously I'll be presenting my view, and 133 00:15:12,300 --> 00:15:18,490 what maybe some of my friends and I talk a lot about. But there are as many different 134 00:15:18,490 --> 00:15:25,250 future views as there are people. So none of this is fact, swish? But, yeah, take 135 00:15:25,250 --> 00:15:35,850 it with a grain of salt. So obviously I put this in the wrong wave thing. We're be 136 00:15:35,850 --> 00:15:43,699 coming from the perspective of digitally fabricatable society. So solar punk also 137 00:15:43,699 --> 00:15:49,619 kind of merges very much technology with ecology, and how to live sustainable in a 138 00:15:49,619 --> 00:15:56,070 world without ravishing it. But still utilizing the developments we do have, and 139 00:15:56,070 --> 00:16:04,550 the knowledge we do have in a good way. So, there are a few ingredients that I 140 00:16:04,550 --> 00:16:13,369 kind of like cherry picked for this. So it's FabCity, Machines Building Machines, 141 00:16:13,369 --> 00:16:20,199 Open Source Ecology and Electronics Home Production or Home Electronics Production, 142 00:16:20,199 --> 00:16:26,939 however you want to put it. So we start with FabCity. FabCity is an initiative. 143 00:16:26,939 --> 00:16:31,579 It's an offspring from the FabLabs movement. It's globally connected cities 144 00:16:31,579 --> 00:16:37,870 for local manufacturing. And this is kind of a mapish with a few of the countries. 145 00:16:37,870 --> 00:16:42,199 But as you can see, I'm not going to read all of these cities out. But you can see 146 00:16:42,199 --> 00:16:46,480 that there's many, and they're all kind of connected in this big network of cities 147 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:55,870 who have proclaimed themselves for local manufacturing. So you got Paris in there, 148 00:16:55,870 --> 00:17:02,649 you got Barcelona in there, you got Seoul, you got Oakland and Detroit, etc. etc. 149 00:17:02,649 --> 00:17:11,119 That's one ingredient. These are just flavors. And then we got Machines Building 150 00:17:11,119 --> 00:17:17,390 Machines. Machines Building Machines is kind of the component that can accelerate 151 00:17:17,390 --> 00:17:21,869 this movement. Because sure, you want local manufacturing. But are you gonna buy 152 00:17:21,869 --> 00:17:25,680 all the machines yourself? Like, is everyone gonna spend a bunch of money to 153 00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:30,410 buy them? No, that's unsustainable. But, if you get the machines to build the 154 00:17:30,410 --> 00:17:35,160 machines, who can then continue building machines, you got this rapid movement 155 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:40,740 going on, right? So Machines Building Machines is a movement that was also 156 00:17:40,740 --> 00:17:49,470 started at Fellesverkstedet in Oslo, together with MIT. So, Fellesverkstedet is 157 00:17:49,470 --> 00:17:59,370 a Fab Lab sprung out of Bitraf, the hacker space in Oslo, beautiful place. And 158 00:17:59,370 --> 00:18:03,440 they've built the first large scale open source CNC machine that's completely 159 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:10,900 parametric and parametric means it's scalable and you can build a small scale 160 00:18:10,900 --> 00:18:20,990 CNC machine with the same design. So CNC, a good one is all you need to build all 161 00:18:20,990 --> 00:18:29,071 the other machines. So we got the first key, which is pretty damn cool. So what 162 00:18:29,071 --> 00:18:32,520 else kind of machines we want to build? Well we want to be able to sustain 163 00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:39,280 ourselves, right? So we got Open Source Ecology, right? Open Source Ecology is 164 00:18:39,280 --> 00:18:44,920 amongst one, a project where they're building 50, I think, agricultural 165 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:52,790 machines in order to locally produce the food you want. And also 'cause the way the 166 00:18:52,790 --> 00:19:00,140 industry around farming works is a little bit corrupt. And we also have projects 167 00:19:00,140 --> 00:19:05,520 such as Romi. Romi project is robotic micro scale for farming. They've just 168 00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:12,800 received a bunch of funding from European Union, yes, to develop the small scale 169 00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:20,860 farming in Barcelona. Here's a brief map on different farms across Europe which 170 00:19:20,860 --> 00:19:26,880 have started or are in the process of actually becoming digitally fabricatable 171 00:19:26,880 --> 00:19:36,240 farming spaces. Yes. Another one, which we mentioned previously this morning, was 172 00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:41,630 Libre Silicon which is really really cool. It's the first time we've kind of 173 00:19:41,630 --> 00:19:46,790 completed the kit now; we can build computers from scratch. And you can do it 174 00:19:46,790 --> 00:19:52,110 in your basement. But this one specifically was for semiconductors, which 175 00:19:52,110 --> 00:20:01,910 was like the missing link. And this is another. It's a ISP programming board 176 00:20:01,910 --> 00:20:10,990 which is standardized by MIT, which they use in Fab Academy, which is hosted all 177 00:20:10,990 --> 00:20:18,200 across the world. And yeah, it's just yet another example of how easy it is to make 178 00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:29,260 circuit boards. All right. So, all that is cool right. But what does it really mean? 179 00:20:29,260 --> 00:20:37,850 It means shoes. No, I'm kidding. But... so to wrap this up we're gonna use an 180 00:20:37,850 --> 00:20:45,080 analogy. So, the analogy starts with shoes. So, let's say you want your shoes. 181 00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:49,390 Because that's something we all use, it's something we all need, right? Let's say 182 00:20:49,390 --> 00:20:54,440 you want shoes, but you don't want to buy them. So you decide to learn how to make 183 00:20:54,440 --> 00:21:01,030 your shoes. Fabulous, right? But let's say the neighbors around you they're like, 184 00:21:01,030 --> 00:21:06,330 "Huh I want shoes too." And previously what we had to do was, obviously, well if 185 00:21:06,330 --> 00:21:09,840 one city learns... has like a shoemaker well then another city has to have one 186 00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:13,940 person who spends all their time learning how to make shoes. That's a lot of time 187 00:21:13,940 --> 00:21:19,120 consumption. So, you have this one city, they learn how to build shoes. You have 188 00:21:19,120 --> 00:21:22,460 another city, they learn how to build shoes. You have another city, they learn 189 00:21:22,460 --> 00:21:26,320 how to build shoes! That's a lot of learning of how to build shoes that's 190 00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:34,280 happening, right? So, what if you just have one person learn how to build shoes 191 00:21:34,280 --> 00:21:41,640 and then they share that information open source. Yaay! Now so many people can build 192 00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:49,630 shoes. Wow. It's incredible. And then, what if you have like villages, spread out 193 00:21:49,630 --> 00:21:55,150 across the world, building shoes and making open source design for maybe even 194 00:21:55,150 --> 00:22:02,150 like toilets or like houses or like showers or kitchen equipment. And they're 195 00:22:02,150 --> 00:22:08,120 connected in a network, then they can share together and continuously develop 196 00:22:08,120 --> 00:22:13,720 the resources and the knowledge on how to actually live. Which is the knowledge that 197 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:22,400 somehow managed to be forgotten in modern society. So yes. A quick side note to 198 00:22:22,400 --> 00:22:29,690 this: I recently heard from Europe's future research director. I don't know if 199 00:22:29,690 --> 00:22:38,070 there's such a thing, but somehow that was kind of her title. The Adidas, I think, 200 00:22:38,070 --> 00:22:46,680 are currently getting into the market of building micro factories instead of 201 00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:52,600 stores. So you can go in there with your old shoe, they'll reuse the material, 202 00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:56,390 break it down, and then you can buy the new design – you don't actually have to 203 00:22:56,390 --> 00:23:02,340 buy the material for the design. So that's kind of their new thinking concept of how 204 00:23:02,340 --> 00:23:14,010 to develop these stores. So, shout out to hackers out there. Just saying. But yeah. 205 00:23:14,010 --> 00:23:20,680 Yes. So, for this we need digital files, right? And how do we spread digital files? 206 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:27,350 Well, our means, our roads, are kind of being compromised in current society. 207 00:23:27,350 --> 00:23:34,410 Which is sad. So this is kind of how I ended up on Scuttlebutt. I was talking to 208 00:23:34,410 --> 00:23:41,080 Alex. He's sitting right there. *mumbles user name* on Scuttlebutt. 209 00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:44,900 And he was like... I was like, oh, in order to build this new society 210 00:23:44,900 --> 00:23:47,390 and like if we're actually gonna do it, and have a change, 211 00:23:47,390 --> 00:23:50,960 make a change in the world, we really need to have like means of 212 00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:59,230 communications that can't be compromised. But... and he was like, huh, haven't you 213 00:23:59,230 --> 00:24:06,620 heard of *laughing* Scuttlebutt or Dat, that project shoutout, or IPFS, shoutout 214 00:24:06,620 --> 00:24:16,820 as well. And I was like, no I haven't, what is this. And then I got on, and yeah, 215 00:24:16,820 --> 00:24:21,500 the story continues. But either way, to get back what we were talking about: 216 00:24:21,500 --> 00:24:29,070 digital files and we need to be able to spread them. And in order to move freely, 217 00:24:29,070 --> 00:24:40,850 we need new protocols, which is what Dat, IPFS, and Scuttlebutt can do. And new 218 00:24:40,850 --> 00:24:46,630 protocols could mean freedom of information and Scuttlebutt could mean 219 00:24:46,630 --> 00:24:57,220 freedom of information. So that's why I'm on Scuttlebutt. Uhm, yes. Welcome to the 220 00:24:57,220 --> 00:25:01,910 Scuttleverse. That's it for me. Thank you. 221 00:25:01,910 --> 00:25:09,740 *Applause* 222 00:25:09,740 --> 00:25:12,550 Herald Angel: Thank you, Zenna. Zenna: Thank you. 223 00:25:12,550 --> 00:25:19,220 Herald: Do we have questions in the room? Please go to the microphone number one or 224 00:25:19,220 --> 00:25:25,700 number two because the people on the stream also want to hear you. 225 00:25:25,700 --> 00:25:29,030 So who's first? One, two, one, two? 226 00:25:29,030 --> 00:25:32,000 I think number two was the first. Say your question please. 227 00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:35,490 Question: So how does Scuttlebutt actually work? What's the transport layer? 228 00:25:35,490 --> 00:25:37,260 Answer: What's the what what? 229 00:25:37,260 --> 00:25:40,681 Q: What's the transport layer? Do you use Wi-Fi, do you use Bluetooth, do you use 230 00:25:40,681 --> 00:25:46,230 something custom? A: As mentioned previously I think, you 231 00:25:46,230 --> 00:25:50,600 can you Sneakernet, you can use... we're actually developing, or some people are, I 232 00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:55,910 don't know who exactly, but I've heard rumored, using Bluetooth. You can use mesh 233 00:25:55,910 --> 00:26:02,120 networks, you can use regular Wi-Fi. Choose your means. You can use radio, if 234 00:26:02,120 --> 00:26:07,630 you really want to. Yeah. Q: So what is implemented right now? 235 00:26:07,630 --> 00:26:15,480 A: Currently, there's been people researching Bluetooth as I mentioned. I 236 00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:21,720 thought I heard a rumor was radio something. That's been on the air. No? 237 00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:30,970 Yes? Yes! It has. Then we've had, I know mesh networks, actual like protocols built 238 00:26:30,970 --> 00:26:37,260 for mesh networks have also been researched upon. Personally, that's the 239 00:26:37,260 --> 00:26:46,080 one I'm looking into the most. And yeah, obviously regular Wi-Fi as well. Yeah. 240 00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:49,220 H: Thank you. Microphone number one please. 241 00:26:49,220 --> 00:26:54,480 Q: You stated that information spread via Scuttlebutt won't travel more than three 242 00:26:54,480 --> 00:27:01,750 degrees of separation. But what about pubs? If someone in your network joins a 243 00:27:01,750 --> 00:27:06,540 pub, won't he flood all his network through the pub? 244 00:27:06,540 --> 00:27:11,490 A: Yes. Q: And because pub usage is common, you 245 00:27:11,490 --> 00:27:20,160 should get a fully connected graph? A: Yes and no. So what's pretty common now 246 00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:24,710 in the early stages: that's kind of what's happening, we think. Obviously we don't 247 00:27:24,710 --> 00:27:34,270 know, but that's what we think. So. Since the community is small enough-ish that a 248 00:27:34,270 --> 00:27:41,520 lot of people have joined similar pubs, there is a pretty cohesive use case of the 249 00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:50,690 pubs. But you're also very capable of just joining your friends' pub for example, or 250 00:27:50,690 --> 00:27:57,980 setting up your own pub, or not using pubs, which is not super recommended, but 251 00:27:57,980 --> 00:28:09,230 it's possible. Yeah. I think that answers the question-ish. Do want to add onto it? 252 00:28:09,230 --> 00:28:13,230 No? Okay. H: Thank you for that. Microphone number 253 00:28:13,230 --> 00:28:17,290 two please. Q: Hello. I have a question. So you know 254 00:28:17,290 --> 00:28:19,450 how people use social media... A: Be a little closer to the microphone. 255 00:28:19,450 --> 00:28:22,300 Q: You hear me now? A: Yes, a little better. 256 00:28:22,300 --> 00:28:24,990 Q: OK. So you know people use social media to talk to their friends... 257 00:28:24,990 --> 00:28:32,070 A: No no no, a little bit closer. Q: OK, they want to talk to their friends. 258 00:28:32,070 --> 00:28:37,640 So like, for example like, if a person... I'll rephrase my question. OK. So, if a 259 00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:41,210 person, like wants to talk to their friend on Facebook, they know that their friend 260 00:28:41,210 --> 00:28:46,120 has a Facebook account, so they can just use Facebook. So like... and you said like 261 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:49,190 Scuttlebutt has a very small community. So how do you entice 262 00:28:49,190 --> 00:28:53,380 people to join, if there's not many people using it? So how does Scuttlebutt address 263 00:28:53,380 --> 00:28:55,600 this problem? Hopefully you understood my question. 264 00:28:55,600 --> 00:29:01,000 A: Yes. Oh, actually I think Andre Staltz 265 00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:04,730 would be better at answering this question, because he's more into the 266 00:29:04,730 --> 00:29:12,360 whole, bringing Scuttlebutt to the masses. Personally, I think we're still in a phase 267 00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:20,870 where there's enough things we need to set... more stable before it reaches the 268 00:29:20,870 --> 00:29:31,190 massive public. That's personally. But I think as any other network, I mean it's 269 00:29:31,190 --> 00:29:39,060 the biggest question for any social media ever out there. How do we get users, you 270 00:29:39,060 --> 00:29:47,860 know? It's what they always ask. And you could say, we could use the route of eco 271 00:29:47,860 --> 00:29:53,530 villages and eco villages using Scuttlebutt. Or we could use the route of 272 00:29:53,530 --> 00:29:58,150 showcasing how much better it is with data privacy. Or we could use the route of 273 00:29:58,150 --> 00:30:03,330 waiting for society to become infringing enough on people's privacy that they have 274 00:30:03,330 --> 00:30:12,710 to use scuttlebutt, or etc., you know? But yeah. It's not a goal of mine, 275 00:30:12,710 --> 00:30:16,670 so I'm not the best person to answer that. Andre Staltz would be much better to 276 00:30:16,670 --> 00:30:19,670 answer that. Yeah. H: Do we have a question from the 277 00:30:19,670 --> 00:30:26,370 interwebs. Not so far, is it? Yes? No? Okay. So microphone number one please. 278 00:30:26,370 --> 00:30:31,150 Q: Hello. My name is Matthew. I'm already a member for scuttlers for two years and 279 00:30:31,150 --> 00:30:35,760 it's more like a question for audience, since we don't meet in real life. 280 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:41,930 Can we have some family photo? A: Aahh, I think that's a great idea! 281 00:30:41,930 --> 00:30:46,460 *clapping* Should we finish after the last question, people who are on Scuttlebutt, 282 00:30:46,460 --> 00:30:50,200 if you come up here, we can take a picture together. It'll be one of the biggest 283 00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:55,410 crabs' meets. H: Nice! Connecting in real life, I love 284 00:30:55,410 --> 00:31:00,410 that. Microphone number two please. Q: So before even centralized social 285 00:31:00,410 --> 00:31:04,860 networks were in existence, people were kind of worried about, what happens if 286 00:31:04,860 --> 00:31:09,640 someone creates lots of fake accounts. And this is a simple attack. Now because the 287 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:16,330 scuttlebutt is distributed, and how does that work the scuttlebutt? Do users have 288 00:31:16,330 --> 00:31:20,340 to manually block these accounts? Or is there some centralized system that blocks 289 00:31:20,340 --> 00:31:26,340 fake accounts? A: So there is no centralized system, to 290 00:31:26,340 --> 00:31:32,540 start there. If someone creates a fake account, I mean, define a fake account. If 291 00:31:32,540 --> 00:31:35,980 I use an account and don't use my real name is that a fake account? You mean 292 00:31:35,980 --> 00:31:38,230 harmfull accounts. Q: Well, just like, you mentioned that you 293 00:31:38,230 --> 00:31:41,660 have three degrees of separation. I could just add 294 00:31:41,660 --> 00:31:46,610 lots of bots to your agent network through that degree of separation, 295 00:31:46,610 --> 00:31:49,900 and then flood your feed with nonsense. 296 00:31:49,900 --> 00:31:56,690 A: OK. Well, there is two responses there. Number 1: There's the whole hardware 297 00:31:56,690 --> 00:31:59,840 thing, that usually when you create an account, it's kind of tied to the 298 00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:04,240 hardware. It's hard to run multiple instances of Scuttlebutt from the same 299 00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:12,020 computer. But that could also be round about it, eventually if research comes on 300 00:32:12,020 --> 00:32:19,630 enough. The second answer would be the whole, you can block people. So yeah, it's 301 00:32:19,630 --> 00:32:23,450 the whole free listening, non-censoring thing. 302 00:32:23,450 --> 00:32:27,830 Q: Ok, yeah. Another thing. You said that, I think, you mentioned that the graph on one 303 00:32:27,830 --> 00:32:31,450 of the first slides, it was distributed but not decentralized? 304 00:32:31,450 --> 00:32:35,540 A: So could you repeat, sorry? Q: On one of the first slides, you said it 305 00:32:35,540 --> 00:32:39,470 was distributed but not decentralized. Could you kind of expand on that a little 306 00:32:39,470 --> 00:32:45,500 bit? A: Uh oooh. Honor had a great slide about 307 00:32:45,500 --> 00:32:52,130 this. I did a talk with them recently, it's uh, there's like, if you actually 308 00:32:52,130 --> 00:32:56,360 search difference between distributed and decentralized, there's this beautiful 309 00:32:56,360 --> 00:33:02,020 picture you can get where it shows like, the mapping of a centralized system was 310 00:33:02,020 --> 00:33:08,050 like a node in the middle that's giant, and those, like small peaks. And then you 311 00:33:08,050 --> 00:33:15,280 have a mapping of a decentralized system where you have the big nodes, and you have 312 00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:22,630 everyone kind of criss crossing, but also very much on focusing on the nodes. And 313 00:33:22,630 --> 00:33:27,970 then you have the whole distributed system. And the distributed system, it's 314 00:33:27,970 --> 00:33:34,580 more direct between peers to peers to peers to peers to peers to peers. But some 315 00:33:34,580 --> 00:33:42,970 people may argue: What about pubs? That make's it decentralized, right? Obviously, 316 00:33:42,970 --> 00:33:48,460 yes and no because you don't have to use pubs. So, yes. 317 00:33:48,460 --> 00:33:53,380 H: So in this case I think we're done. Thank you very much. 318 00:33:53,380 --> 00:33:55,960 Zenna: Thank you! H: People, a warm applause for Zenna! 319 00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:58,986 *Applause* 320 00:33:58,986 --> 00:34:02,991 *postroll music* 321 00:34:02,991 --> 00:34:22,000 subtitles created by c3subtitles.de in the year 2019. Join, and help us!