0 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:30,000 Dear viewer, these subtitles were generated by a machine via the service Trint and therefore are (very) buggy. If you are capable, please help us to create good quality subtitles: https://c3subtitles.de/talk/87 Thanks! 1 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:12,579 OK, next up, we have Trevor Paglen 2 00:00:12,580 --> 00:00:14,649 and the six landscapes 3 00:00:14,650 --> 00:00:16,989 of the savait surveillance state. 4 00:00:16,990 --> 00:00:18,729 Something like that, you know, we'll work 5 00:00:18,730 --> 00:00:20,649 it out. OK, thank hard place for Trevor. 6 00:00:27,290 --> 00:00:28,939 Thank you, guys, all so much for coming 7 00:00:28,940 --> 00:00:31,459 here, this is a fantastic honor 8 00:00:31,460 --> 00:00:33,169 to be here with you all. 9 00:00:33,170 --> 00:00:34,729 But let's let's get right into it. 10 00:00:34,730 --> 00:00:36,169 We don't have as much time as I would 11 00:00:36,170 --> 00:00:36,679 like to have, 12 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:38,539 but it's always like that. 13 00:00:38,540 --> 00:00:40,189 I've been spending a lot of time in 14 00:00:40,190 --> 00:00:41,479 helicopters lately. 15 00:00:43,580 --> 00:00:45,979 I'm an artist, but I'm not somebody 16 00:00:45,980 --> 00:00:47,869 who goes into a studio every day with 17 00:00:47,870 --> 00:00:49,809 some paint and makes a mess and comes out 18 00:00:49,810 --> 00:00:52,009 the at the end of the day with a painting 19 00:00:52,010 --> 00:00:53,119 or anything like that. 20 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:55,999 I have a very empirical practice, 21 00:00:56,000 --> 00:00:57,889 meaning I go out in the world to do 22 00:00:57,890 --> 00:00:59,389 things, and they spend a lot of time 23 00:00:59,390 --> 00:01:02,059 running around looking at stuff. 24 00:01:02,060 --> 00:01:04,309 And one of the overarching themes 25 00:01:04,310 --> 00:01:05,299 of my projects 26 00:01:05,300 --> 00:01:06,799 has to do with 27 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:09,019 trying to push vision 28 00:01:09,020 --> 00:01:10,009 and trying to 29 00:01:10,010 --> 00:01:12,079 push perception 30 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:14,629 as far as I can, 31 00:01:14,630 --> 00:01:16,489 usually to the point where it starts to 32 00:01:16,490 --> 00:01:17,479 break down. 33 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:18,859 And the reason for that 34 00:01:18,860 --> 00:01:20,209 is that I hope 35 00:01:20,210 --> 00:01:21,829 that by investigating some of these 36 00:01:21,830 --> 00:01:23,629 limited cases of vision of these limit 37 00:01:23,630 --> 00:01:25,699 cases of perception that we 38 00:01:25,700 --> 00:01:27,769 can kind of create a vantage point that 39 00:01:27,770 --> 00:01:30,049 we can then use to look back on ourselves 40 00:01:30,050 --> 00:01:31,699 with different kinds of 41 00:01:31,700 --> 00:01:33,979 eyes, with fresh eyes, 42 00:01:33,980 --> 00:01:34,939 if you will. 43 00:01:34,940 --> 00:01:36,529 And for me, that's really what I want out 44 00:01:36,530 --> 00:01:37,579 of art. 45 00:01:37,580 --> 00:01:38,839 A lot of people want a lot of different 46 00:01:38,840 --> 00:01:40,279 things out of the arts and people want 47 00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:42,109 beauty. Some people want something nice 48 00:01:42,110 --> 00:01:43,429 that hangs on their sofa or whatever. 49 00:01:43,430 --> 00:01:45,649 What I want out of art is things 50 00:01:45,650 --> 00:01:46,219 that help 51 00:01:46,220 --> 00:01:47,269 us see the 52 00:01:47,270 --> 00:01:49,699 historical moment that we're living in. 53 00:01:49,700 --> 00:01:51,229 So that's what I want. 54 00:01:51,230 --> 00:01:52,609 And so for me, that's 55 00:01:52,610 --> 00:01:55,099 that's what this is sort of about 56 00:01:55,100 --> 00:01:56,719 today. I want to talk about 57 00:01:56,720 --> 00:01:58,279 secrecy, 58 00:01:58,280 --> 00:01:59,119 and I want to talk 59 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:00,829 about how to go about 60 00:02:00,830 --> 00:02:02,839 trying to see 61 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:04,099 secrecy. 62 00:02:04,100 --> 00:02:05,629 And this is something that I've spent a 63 00:02:05,630 --> 00:02:07,759 lot of time thinking about 64 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:08,760 over the years. 65 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:14,659 A lot of times people think about secrecy 66 00:02:14,660 --> 00:02:16,189 as what you 67 00:02:16,190 --> 00:02:17,119 get to know 68 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:17,779 versus 69 00:02:17,780 --> 00:02:19,609 what you don't get to know. 70 00:02:19,610 --> 00:02:20,779 So secrecy is stuff that we 71 00:02:20,780 --> 00:02:22,639 don't get to know, and stuff that's not 72 00:02:22,640 --> 00:02:23,299 secret 73 00:02:23,300 --> 00:02:24,739 is is stuff that we 74 00:02:24,740 --> 00:02:25,879 do get to know. 75 00:02:25,880 --> 00:02:27,859 And I think that that way of thinking 76 00:02:27,860 --> 00:02:29,879 about secrecy is wrong. 77 00:02:29,880 --> 00:02:32,479 Right? I think in the first instance, 78 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:34,729 secrecy is more about 79 00:02:34,730 --> 00:02:35,569 a way of 80 00:02:35,570 --> 00:02:36,469 doing things. 81 00:02:36,470 --> 00:02:38,779 It's a way of trying to organize 82 00:02:38,780 --> 00:02:40,399 human activities. 83 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:42,259 And it has political aspects to it. 84 00:02:42,260 --> 00:02:44,089 It has economic aspects to it. 85 00:02:44,090 --> 00:02:45,799 It has legal aspects to it and has 86 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:47,689 cultural aspects to it. 87 00:02:47,690 --> 00:02:50,929 And it's a way of trying to do things 88 00:02:50,930 --> 00:02:53,989 whose goal is invisibility, 89 00:02:53,990 --> 00:02:56,389 silence, obscurity. 90 00:02:56,390 --> 00:02:58,399 And so in this first instance of what 91 00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:00,289 secrecy is, I would think about it as 92 00:03:00,290 --> 00:03:02,629 what we might call an abstract space, 93 00:03:02,630 --> 00:03:04,669 a kind of organizing logic. 94 00:03:04,670 --> 00:03:05,929 And they call it an abstract 95 00:03:05,930 --> 00:03:09,169 space because it doesn't actually exist. 96 00:03:09,170 --> 00:03:10,369 It's a it's a 97 00:03:10,370 --> 00:03:12,889 it's a it's a conceptual thing. 98 00:03:12,890 --> 00:03:14,899 It's a way of trying to organize things. 99 00:03:14,900 --> 00:03:16,969 It's in an at first instance, secrecy is 100 00:03:16,970 --> 00:03:18,110 very immaterial. 101 00:03:19,610 --> 00:03:22,369 However, in the real world, 102 00:03:22,370 --> 00:03:24,439 secrecy only exists 103 00:03:24,440 --> 00:03:26,869 insofar as its logic 104 00:03:26,870 --> 00:03:29,119 is applied to things in the world. 105 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:30,139 In other words, the 106 00:03:30,140 --> 00:03:32,479 material stuff that 107 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:34,039 everything in the world is made up. 108 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:35,239 So in real life, 109 00:03:35,240 --> 00:03:35,869 secrecy is 110 00:03:35,870 --> 00:03:37,579 composed of infrastructures and 111 00:03:37,580 --> 00:03:40,099 institutions, things like the CIA 112 00:03:40,100 --> 00:03:42,529 or the NSA, economic 113 00:03:42,530 --> 00:03:44,119 institutions like the 114 00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:45,109 the so-called black 115 00:03:45,110 --> 00:03:46,219 budget in the United 116 00:03:46,220 --> 00:03:48,169 States. It also is composed of 117 00:03:48,170 --> 00:03:50,239 social engineering institutions 118 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:51,559 such as the 119 00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:52,039 security 120 00:03:52,040 --> 00:03:54,289 classification system, legal 121 00:03:54,290 --> 00:03:56,539 institutions such as the FISA 122 00:03:56,540 --> 00:03:58,669 court and the state secrets, president 123 00:03:58,670 --> 00:04:00,079 of the United States, and so on and so 124 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:02,299 on. So all 125 00:04:02,300 --> 00:04:03,889 of that is a way of trying to underline 126 00:04:03,890 --> 00:04:05,779 the fact that I don't think about secrecy 127 00:04:05,780 --> 00:04:07,909 as what you get to know versus what you 128 00:04:07,910 --> 00:04:09,049 don't get to know. 129 00:04:09,050 --> 00:04:11,149 I think about it instead as a 130 00:04:11,150 --> 00:04:13,399 kind of state within a state, 131 00:04:13,400 --> 00:04:14,929 a state that operates according to a 132 00:04:14,930 --> 00:04:15,199 very, 133 00:04:15,200 --> 00:04:17,028 very different logic than what we would 134 00:04:17,029 --> 00:04:19,369 normally think of as a democratic state 135 00:04:19,370 --> 00:04:21,648 and also as a series 136 00:04:21,649 --> 00:04:23,719 of material practices, 137 00:04:23,720 --> 00:04:24,799 things that happen 138 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:25,880 in the world. 139 00:04:27,110 --> 00:04:29,540 So the question then is 140 00:04:31,370 --> 00:04:32,959 if secrecy is a way 141 00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:35,359 of organizing institutions and 142 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:37,429 human activities in such a way 143 00:04:37,430 --> 00:04:39,259 as to try to render them silent, to 144 00:04:39,260 --> 00:04:40,459 render them invisible? 145 00:04:40,460 --> 00:04:41,899 How do we go about trying 146 00:04:41,900 --> 00:04:44,269 to see them right? 147 00:04:44,270 --> 00:04:46,429 And sometimes when I talk about how do we 148 00:04:46,430 --> 00:04:48,169 go about trying to see secrecy, I use 149 00:04:48,170 --> 00:04:49,969 this metaphor from cosmology, the 150 00:04:49,970 --> 00:04:52,099 metaphor of dark matter, where we 151 00:04:52,100 --> 00:04:54,019 know that ninety seven percent of the 152 00:04:54,020 --> 00:04:56,179 universe is made out of dark matter 153 00:04:56,180 --> 00:04:58,099 and dark energy. It's stuff that we can't 154 00:04:58,100 --> 00:05:00,259 see. We can't directly detect, but we 155 00:05:00,260 --> 00:05:02,479 can infer its existence by the 156 00:05:02,480 --> 00:05:04,669 influence that it exerts on 157 00:05:04,670 --> 00:05:06,239 the visible universe. 158 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:07,789 Right. So it's something that we can only 159 00:05:07,790 --> 00:05:10,399 indirectly detect. 160 00:05:10,400 --> 00:05:12,739 And so in other words, 161 00:05:12,740 --> 00:05:14,299 by seeing that interaction of this 162 00:05:14,300 --> 00:05:15,709 invisible matter with the invisible 163 00:05:15,710 --> 00:05:17,749 matter, we can learn something about it. 164 00:05:17,750 --> 00:05:19,609 And I think perhaps something is true of 165 00:05:19,610 --> 00:05:21,049 secrecy as well, 166 00:05:21,050 --> 00:05:22,609 because I think that secrecy is an 167 00:05:22,610 --> 00:05:25,339 inherently contradictory 168 00:05:25,340 --> 00:05:25,869 thing. It's. 169 00:05:25,870 --> 00:05:28,089 A self-contradictory thing, 170 00:05:28,090 --> 00:05:30,249 and the reason for that is that 171 00:05:30,250 --> 00:05:31,809 this organizing logic of 172 00:05:31,810 --> 00:05:34,479 secrecy, as it has to 173 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:37,329 take hold, is as is articulated 174 00:05:37,330 --> 00:05:38,679 in the material world. 175 00:05:38,680 --> 00:05:41,919 It's never completely efficient. 176 00:05:41,920 --> 00:05:44,589 And in the first instance, 177 00:05:44,590 --> 00:05:47,289 the idea of secrecy is not efficient 178 00:05:47,290 --> 00:05:49,359 because if it's true that secrecy 179 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:50,979 has to be made out of the same stuff that 180 00:05:50,980 --> 00:05:52,509 the rest of the world is made out of, 181 00:05:52,510 --> 00:05:54,579 stuff in the world tends to 182 00:05:54,580 --> 00:05:56,379 reflect light, right? 183 00:05:56,380 --> 00:05:58,809 It's visible kind of fundamentally. 184 00:05:58,810 --> 00:06:01,629 And so we have this kind of original 185 00:06:01,630 --> 00:06:03,699 contradiction in the idea 186 00:06:03,700 --> 00:06:05,289 of secrecy. So for example, if you're 187 00:06:05,290 --> 00:06:06,009 going to build 188 00:06:06,010 --> 00:06:07,629 a secret airplane, 189 00:06:07,630 --> 00:06:09,429 you can't build it in an invisible 190 00:06:09,430 --> 00:06:11,409 factory with ghost workers, you have to 191 00:06:11,410 --> 00:06:12,909 build it in a factory that looks like any 192 00:06:12,910 --> 00:06:14,139 kind of other factory. 193 00:06:14,140 --> 00:06:16,059 You have to build it with people 194 00:06:16,060 --> 00:06:18,069 that, you know, do same kinds of things 195 00:06:18,070 --> 00:06:19,449 that any other person does. 196 00:06:19,450 --> 00:06:21,039 So secrecy is not efficient. 197 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:22,929 It has this originally contradiction, and 198 00:06:22,930 --> 00:06:24,579 I think that that originally 199 00:06:24,580 --> 00:06:25,689 contradiction 200 00:06:25,690 --> 00:06:27,819 gives rise to all sorts of 201 00:06:27,820 --> 00:06:30,159 other kinds of contradictions. 202 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:32,289 And so methodologically, what I'm 203 00:06:32,290 --> 00:06:34,599 trying to do often is find 204 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:35,679 those contradictions. 205 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:37,359 Where does that secret 206 00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:39,459 world intersect with something I can 207 00:06:39,460 --> 00:06:41,709 see? Where is it intersect with 208 00:06:41,710 --> 00:06:43,899 something that I can 209 00:06:43,900 --> 00:06:45,370 find and. 210 00:06:46,830 --> 00:06:48,929 Using that methodology, trying to 211 00:06:48,930 --> 00:06:51,089 get a glimpse into 212 00:06:51,090 --> 00:06:53,189 the aspects of secrecy and the 213 00:06:53,190 --> 00:06:54,959 secret state that surrounds us 214 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:57,389 all of the time, but that we 215 00:06:57,390 --> 00:06:58,049 really 216 00:06:58,050 --> 00:06:59,909 generally have not trained ourselves to 217 00:06:59,910 --> 00:07:02,009 see very well. 218 00:07:02,010 --> 00:07:03,719 So when I talk about a series of these 219 00:07:03,720 --> 00:07:05,070 kinds of contradictions. 220 00:07:07,270 --> 00:07:08,949 One contradiction that has been 221 00:07:08,950 --> 00:07:10,569 enormously helpful to me has to do with 222 00:07:10,570 --> 00:07:11,829 logistics. 223 00:07:11,830 --> 00:07:14,559 Logistics is logistics. 224 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:16,179 If you are going to, you know, as the 225 00:07:16,180 --> 00:07:17,679 United States does, if you're going to 226 00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:18,729 operate, you know, secret 227 00:07:18,730 --> 00:07:20,169 wars all over the 228 00:07:20,170 --> 00:07:21,519 world and you're going to have, you know, 229 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:24,039 military bases in, you know, nearly 200 230 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:26,319 countries and spying posts and spy 231 00:07:26,320 --> 00:07:27,939 satellites in this sort of thing, you 232 00:07:27,940 --> 00:07:29,019 need to have logistical 233 00:07:29,020 --> 00:07:31,509 infrastructures to support that 234 00:07:31,510 --> 00:07:33,429 to, you know, ferry people around, move 235 00:07:33,430 --> 00:07:35,439 things around that sort of thing. 236 00:07:35,440 --> 00:07:37,839 A crucial part of any logistical 237 00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:39,339 infrastructure tends to involve 238 00:07:39,340 --> 00:07:41,049 airplanes. 239 00:07:41,050 --> 00:07:42,609 Just because you have to fly people 240 00:07:42,610 --> 00:07:44,289 around documents around and so on and so 241 00:07:44,290 --> 00:07:46,989 forth. And so a number of years ago, 242 00:07:46,990 --> 00:07:49,069 this is something that I picked on 243 00:07:49,070 --> 00:07:49,779 quite a lot. 244 00:07:49,780 --> 00:07:52,179 I was very interested in the CIA's 245 00:07:52,180 --> 00:07:53,739 extraordinary rendition program. 246 00:07:53,740 --> 00:07:55,929 This is their kidnaping and torture 247 00:07:55,930 --> 00:07:57,909 program that they were running all over 248 00:07:57,910 --> 00:07:58,809 the world. 249 00:07:58,810 --> 00:08:01,569 And one of the theories that 250 00:08:01,570 --> 00:08:03,759 that this is a guy who spent some time 251 00:08:03,760 --> 00:08:04,779 working with on this stuff. 252 00:08:06,340 --> 00:08:08,019 One of the ideas that I 253 00:08:08,020 --> 00:08:09,249 was working with an investigative 254 00:08:09,250 --> 00:08:10,659 journalist and there was about a dozen 255 00:08:10,660 --> 00:08:12,279 people around the world from human rights 256 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:13,569 groups, other journalists who were trying 257 00:08:13,570 --> 00:08:15,069 to figure this stuff out. 258 00:08:15,070 --> 00:08:16,119 One of the ideas 259 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:18,669 was that if you could 260 00:08:18,670 --> 00:08:20,829 track the movements of airplanes 261 00:08:20,830 --> 00:08:22,779 that were known to be involved in this 262 00:08:22,780 --> 00:08:23,619 program, then you could 263 00:08:23,620 --> 00:08:25,449 perhaps get 264 00:08:25,450 --> 00:08:27,519 an understanding of 265 00:08:27,520 --> 00:08:29,799 what the geography of this covert 266 00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:30,369 action 267 00:08:30,370 --> 00:08:31,269 looked like, right? 268 00:08:31,270 --> 00:08:33,939 We knew people were disappearing 269 00:08:33,940 --> 00:08:35,259 from all over the world. 270 00:08:35,260 --> 00:08:37,359 We didn't know where there were going. 271 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:39,308 The CIA or the military would come out 272 00:08:39,309 --> 00:08:40,689 and say something like, Oh, well, we, 273 00:08:40,690 --> 00:08:43,029 we caught Abu Zubaydah, for example. 274 00:08:43,030 --> 00:08:44,379 And then this guy wouldn't show up at 275 00:08:44,380 --> 00:08:45,969 Guantanamo Bay. 276 00:08:45,970 --> 00:08:47,019 And so if you thought about it, 277 00:08:47,020 --> 00:08:48,129 you thought, Well, this 278 00:08:48,130 --> 00:08:50,589 guy has to be in the world somewhere. 279 00:08:50,590 --> 00:08:52,029 And because this guy has to be in the 280 00:08:52,030 --> 00:08:53,589 world somewhere, there's got to be some 281 00:08:53,590 --> 00:08:54,699 secret prisons out there. 282 00:08:54,700 --> 00:08:56,259 So that's one thing we were interested 283 00:08:56,260 --> 00:08:57,039 in. 284 00:08:57,040 --> 00:08:59,439 Now the other kind of classic, 285 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:00,519 the classic way 286 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:02,229 that you organize logistics, if you're 287 00:09:02,230 --> 00:09:04,719 the Central Intelligence Agency or 288 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:06,579 certain parts of the military is that you 289 00:09:06,580 --> 00:09:08,829 create front companies, you create 290 00:09:08,830 --> 00:09:11,019 fake companies to do 291 00:09:11,020 --> 00:09:12,069 your logistics for you. 292 00:09:12,070 --> 00:09:13,779 And this is a very, very good 293 00:09:13,780 --> 00:09:14,559 idea for 294 00:09:14,560 --> 00:09:15,560 several reasons. 295 00:09:16,630 --> 00:09:18,069 First of all, it's a good idea because it 296 00:09:18,070 --> 00:09:20,559 keeps your name off of things. 297 00:09:20,560 --> 00:09:22,329 Right? So you don't you can create a fake 298 00:09:22,330 --> 00:09:23,589 company that's doing stuff around the 299 00:09:23,590 --> 00:09:25,209 world. It doesn't ever 300 00:09:25,210 --> 00:09:27,279 say CIA or NSA 301 00:09:27,280 --> 00:09:27,399 or 302 00:09:27,400 --> 00:09:29,259 whatever it is anywhere in the paperwork 303 00:09:29,260 --> 00:09:29,589 that you have 304 00:09:29,590 --> 00:09:31,149 to file. So it's a very, very good 305 00:09:31,150 --> 00:09:32,889 idea in that sense. 306 00:09:32,890 --> 00:09:35,019 It's a very good idea in a second sense 307 00:09:35,020 --> 00:09:35,889 as well, 308 00:09:35,890 --> 00:09:36,549 which is that 309 00:09:36,550 --> 00:09:39,069 there is much more freedom of movement 310 00:09:39,070 --> 00:09:41,829 afforded to civilians 311 00:09:41,830 --> 00:09:43,809 than there is to the world's military. 312 00:09:43,810 --> 00:09:46,119 So for example, if you want to charter 313 00:09:46,120 --> 00:09:48,339 airplane tomorrow and fly to Karachi, 314 00:09:48,340 --> 00:09:49,389 Pakistan. 315 00:09:49,390 --> 00:09:50,799 That's absolutely no problem. 316 00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:52,569 You have to pay overflight fees and some 317 00:09:52,570 --> 00:09:54,639 landing fees, but it's no big deal. 318 00:09:54,640 --> 00:09:56,229 If you're the military to tomorrow and 319 00:09:56,230 --> 00:09:57,849 you fly a bunch of planes into Karachi, 320 00:09:57,850 --> 00:09:59,439 you just started a war. 321 00:09:59,440 --> 00:10:01,389 So it's creating fake companies is a 322 00:10:01,390 --> 00:10:03,579 great idea for freedom of movement as 323 00:10:03,580 --> 00:10:04,509 well. 324 00:10:04,510 --> 00:10:06,639 The problem is 325 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:08,379 with creating fake companies is that you 326 00:10:08,380 --> 00:10:09,999 have to file all the same kinds of 327 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:12,429 paperwork that any other company 328 00:10:12,430 --> 00:10:13,989 in the world has to file. 329 00:10:13,990 --> 00:10:15,729 And the aviation industry is a highly 330 00:10:15,730 --> 00:10:16,749 regulated industry. 331 00:10:16,750 --> 00:10:19,359 You generate an enormous paper trail. 332 00:10:19,360 --> 00:10:21,129 And so the theory was 333 00:10:21,130 --> 00:10:23,679 if we can identify what 334 00:10:23,680 --> 00:10:25,419 airplane companies we think are involved 335 00:10:25,420 --> 00:10:27,489 in this program, we might 336 00:10:27,490 --> 00:10:29,739 be able to track them 337 00:10:29,740 --> 00:10:31,329 somehow and learn something about the 338 00:10:31,330 --> 00:10:33,189 geography of this program. 339 00:10:33,190 --> 00:10:35,289 So we're thinking about what are all 340 00:10:35,290 --> 00:10:36,879 the things that I would want to be able 341 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:39,279 to do if I was a front company working 342 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:41,169 for the CIA, flying all over the world. 343 00:10:41,170 --> 00:10:42,369 And one of the things that we thought of 344 00:10:42,370 --> 00:10:43,059 was, well, what 345 00:10:43,060 --> 00:10:44,649 I'd want to be able to do 346 00:10:44,650 --> 00:10:47,229 is land at military air bases 347 00:10:47,230 --> 00:10:48,909 anywhere I wanted in the world. 348 00:10:48,910 --> 00:10:50,469 I want to be able to refuel 349 00:10:50,470 --> 00:10:51,939 at military air bases. 350 00:10:51,940 --> 00:10:53,499 And so we had the idea of writing to the 351 00:10:53,500 --> 00:10:56,019 military and asking, Hey, can you 352 00:10:56,020 --> 00:10:58,869 give us a list of all the civilian 353 00:10:58,870 --> 00:11:01,149 companies who have clearances to land 354 00:11:01,150 --> 00:11:01,749 at military 355 00:11:01,750 --> 00:11:04,359 airfields and what clearances that they 356 00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:05,379 what airfields have 357 00:11:05,380 --> 00:11:06,699 clearances to land at? 358 00:11:06,700 --> 00:11:08,119 So you get this document right here. 359 00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:09,309 There's the older version, something 360 00:11:09,310 --> 00:11:11,529 called the cap, and 361 00:11:11,530 --> 00:11:13,629 it basically is a list of companies 362 00:11:13,630 --> 00:11:15,189 who who are allowed to land at military 363 00:11:15,190 --> 00:11:16,509 airfields and which ones they can do 364 00:11:16,510 --> 00:11:17,919 that. It's so on this list, you'll find 365 00:11:17,920 --> 00:11:20,589 things like Alaska Airlines, 366 00:11:20,590 --> 00:11:21,309 you know, 367 00:11:21,310 --> 00:11:22,809 UPS, 368 00:11:22,810 --> 00:11:24,939 DHL, you know, mostly 369 00:11:24,940 --> 00:11:25,869 companies that do 370 00:11:25,870 --> 00:11:27,939 logistics also for 371 00:11:27,940 --> 00:11:29,499 the military. 372 00:11:29,500 --> 00:11:31,469 But when you start to get in the guts of 373 00:11:31,470 --> 00:11:33,159 the vast majority of these only have 374 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:35,499 clearances to land in Kona's. 375 00:11:35,500 --> 00:11:38,439 That means continental United States. 376 00:11:38,440 --> 00:11:39,669 But when you get further into this 377 00:11:39,670 --> 00:11:41,499 document, some weird things emerge. 378 00:11:41,500 --> 00:11:43,389 You start to find companies like this 379 00:11:43,390 --> 00:11:45,519 Stevens Express leasing, who has 380 00:11:45,520 --> 00:11:47,199 a worldwide clearance. 381 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:49,209 They can land at any military airfield 382 00:11:49,210 --> 00:11:50,210 they want. 383 00:11:51,430 --> 00:11:53,019 Rich Moore Aviation. 384 00:11:53,020 --> 00:11:54,669 We're going to come back to these guys. 385 00:11:56,170 --> 00:11:57,549 Rapid air trans. 386 00:11:57,550 --> 00:11:59,529 All of these have world wide clearances. 387 00:11:59,530 --> 00:12:01,329 These very strange companies. 388 00:12:01,330 --> 00:12:02,739 Path Corp. 389 00:12:02,740 --> 00:12:05,109 Premiere Executive Transport 390 00:12:05,110 --> 00:12:06,110 Services. 391 00:12:09,080 --> 00:12:11,599 Anyway, so there's varying 392 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:13,249 degrees of what goes on with these 393 00:12:13,250 --> 00:12:15,169 companies, which more aviation has, you 394 00:12:15,170 --> 00:12:16,789 know, some actual places. 395 00:12:16,790 --> 00:12:18,559 I got really interested in this company, 396 00:12:18,560 --> 00:12:20,359 though here premiere executive transport 397 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:21,559 services who had pulled the 398 00:12:21,560 --> 00:12:23,899 paperwork from the FAA 399 00:12:23,900 --> 00:12:25,309 on file. And it turns out they have an 400 00:12:25,310 --> 00:12:27,259 address. Premiere Executive Transport 401 00:12:27,260 --> 00:12:29,389 Services three thirty nine Washington 402 00:12:29,390 --> 00:12:32,839 Street Suite 202 Dedham, Massachusetts 403 00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:34,429 In this building right here, they're 404 00:12:34,430 --> 00:12:36,349 located on the second floor. 405 00:12:36,350 --> 00:12:38,689 The sign outside says Hill and Plate U.S. 406 00:12:38,690 --> 00:12:40,219 attorneys. 407 00:12:40,220 --> 00:12:42,109 These are a couple of divorce lawyers 408 00:12:42,110 --> 00:12:43,159 outside of Boston. 409 00:12:50,150 --> 00:12:52,459 So when I went in there and asked 410 00:12:52,460 --> 00:12:54,469 them to talk to somebody about premier 411 00:12:54,470 --> 00:12:56,329 executive transport services, they threw 412 00:12:56,330 --> 00:12:57,330 me out 413 00:12:58,730 --> 00:12:59,599 I. 414 00:12:59,600 --> 00:13:00,829 But I did, you know, they just 415 00:13:00,830 --> 00:13:03,139 kept looking at this company, you 416 00:13:03,140 --> 00:13:05,119 know, company, it's a public company has 417 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:07,609 to file all kinds of, you know, articles 418 00:13:07,610 --> 00:13:09,679 of incorporation, you know, updates, tax 419 00:13:09,680 --> 00:13:10,909 filings, that sort of thing. 420 00:13:10,910 --> 00:13:12,589 I got real interested in people who were 421 00:13:12,590 --> 00:13:15,079 on the boards and the the 422 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:15,799 the staff of 423 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:16,909 these companies started 424 00:13:16,910 --> 00:13:18,709 collecting their signatures, finding 425 00:13:18,710 --> 00:13:20,839 people like Colin Barnett, 426 00:13:20,840 --> 00:13:23,299 Brian Davis, James 427 00:13:23,300 --> 00:13:24,300 Kershaw, 428 00:13:25,130 --> 00:13:25,699 Tyler 429 00:13:25,700 --> 00:13:27,229 Edward Tait. This is my all time 430 00:13:27,230 --> 00:13:28,230 favorite. 431 00:13:30,020 --> 00:13:31,339 If you haven't figured this out yet, 432 00:13:31,340 --> 00:13:33,589 Tyler, Edward Tate's not a real person. 433 00:13:33,590 --> 00:13:35,359 Tyler Edward Tate has a 434 00:13:35,360 --> 00:13:37,519 birthday in the 1950s, but a Social 435 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:40,009 Security number issued in the 1990s 436 00:13:40,010 --> 00:13:41,839 has no credit rating. 437 00:13:41,840 --> 00:13:43,069 Never got a loan from a bank. 438 00:13:43,070 --> 00:13:44,779 Never got a driver's license, never got 439 00:13:44,780 --> 00:13:46,489 married. Doesn't really have any of the 440 00:13:46,490 --> 00:13:48,649 electronic trail that each of us generate 441 00:13:48,650 --> 00:13:52,009 really every few seconds in our lives. 442 00:13:52,010 --> 00:13:54,199 Tyler Edward Tate's only address 443 00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:56,359 was this appeal box at this post 444 00:13:56,360 --> 00:13:58,069 office outside the airport 445 00:13:58,070 --> 00:14:00,529 in Washington, DC Box 446 00:14:00,530 --> 00:14:02,359 two two one nine four 447 00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:03,649 three. 448 00:14:03,650 --> 00:14:05,029 So I did a reverse record 449 00:14:05,030 --> 00:14:07,609 search on the P.O. box and hundreds 450 00:14:07,610 --> 00:14:08,899 of names 451 00:14:08,900 --> 00:14:09,900 show up. 452 00:14:16,970 --> 00:14:19,789 And these are all these are ghosts. 453 00:14:19,790 --> 00:14:20,209 These are 454 00:14:20,210 --> 00:14:22,159 all of these names are people who don't 455 00:14:22,160 --> 00:14:24,169 exist and they don't exist because 456 00:14:24,170 --> 00:14:25,849 they're in the business of disappearing 457 00:14:25,850 --> 00:14:26,119 other 458 00:14:26,120 --> 00:14:27,120 people. 459 00:14:27,830 --> 00:14:28,789 But going back to the 460 00:14:28,790 --> 00:14:30,199 airplane companies, what you could 461 00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:31,339 do because these 462 00:14:31,340 --> 00:14:32,869 are civilian airplane companies, you had 463 00:14:32,870 --> 00:14:34,429 a list of companies that you're 464 00:14:34,430 --> 00:14:36,169 interested in. You go back to the FAA and 465 00:14:36,170 --> 00:14:38,419 say, I want to see all the registration 466 00:14:38,420 --> 00:14:40,009 numbers and serial numbers for all of the 467 00:14:40,010 --> 00:14:42,139 airplanes that are owned by this set of 468 00:14:42,140 --> 00:14:43,579 companies. So you get back the list of 469 00:14:43,580 --> 00:14:45,349 airplanes, registration number, serial 470 00:14:45,350 --> 00:14:47,029 numbers and you go back to the FAA and 471 00:14:47,030 --> 00:14:48,319 you say, I would like to see all the 472 00:14:48,320 --> 00:14:49,789 flight plans that 473 00:14:49,790 --> 00:14:50,929 these particular 474 00:14:50,930 --> 00:14:52,459 airplanes have ever filed with the new 475 00:14:52,460 --> 00:14:53,419 start to get documents 476 00:14:53,420 --> 00:14:55,169 that look like this. 477 00:14:55,170 --> 00:14:56,989 You get the registration number 478 00:14:58,510 --> 00:14:58,879 of 479 00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:00,589 airplane landed iAd. 480 00:15:00,590 --> 00:15:03,109 That means Washington Dulles. 481 00:15:03,110 --> 00:15:05,689 This one right here BGR 482 00:15:05,690 --> 00:15:07,429 is Bangor, Maine. 483 00:15:07,430 --> 00:15:09,649 KFYI is the home of the Special Forces 484 00:15:09,650 --> 00:15:12,259 Community in Fayetteville, North Carolina 485 00:15:12,260 --> 00:15:14,749 III and Shannon Ireland. 486 00:15:14,750 --> 00:15:16,850 MGM Guantanamo Bay. 487 00:15:18,860 --> 00:15:19,379 So we started 488 00:15:19,380 --> 00:15:20,999 tracking different 489 00:15:21,000 --> 00:15:21,749 routes 490 00:15:21,750 --> 00:15:23,249 where all these things were flying, the 491 00:15:23,250 --> 00:15:24,209 idea being if you could 492 00:15:24,210 --> 00:15:26,459 see multiple 493 00:15:26,460 --> 00:15:28,619 flights to a single location, 494 00:15:28,620 --> 00:15:30,569 perhaps that was a place to 495 00:15:30,570 --> 00:15:32,129 pay some more attention to. 496 00:15:32,130 --> 00:15:32,819 I'm going to 497 00:15:32,820 --> 00:15:33,809 fly through this. 498 00:15:33,810 --> 00:15:35,519 I've talked about this quite a lot 499 00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:36,629 and there's documentation of these 500 00:15:36,630 --> 00:15:37,649 projects online. 501 00:15:37,650 --> 00:15:39,959 We had other sources of information 502 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:42,059 as well. This is a map drawn by 503 00:15:42,060 --> 00:15:43,799 a former ghost prisoner, a guy named 504 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:45,389 Khalid El-Masri of What do you believe 505 00:15:45,390 --> 00:15:47,939 the inside of one of these black 506 00:15:47,940 --> 00:15:49,049 or dark prisons 507 00:15:49,050 --> 00:15:50,519 look like? 508 00:15:50,520 --> 00:15:52,859 And using this combination of information 509 00:15:52,860 --> 00:15:54,389 tracking, flight plans and that sort of 510 00:15:54,390 --> 00:15:55,349 thing, we're able 511 00:15:55,350 --> 00:15:56,350 to figure out 512 00:15:57,540 --> 00:15:58,679 the very probable 513 00:15:58,680 --> 00:16:00,869 location of a CIA black site 514 00:16:00,870 --> 00:16:02,519 north east 515 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:04,139 of Kabul. 516 00:16:04,140 --> 00:16:06,869 And so in this this building. 517 00:16:06,870 --> 00:16:09,269 So we flew out there and 518 00:16:09,270 --> 00:16:11,429 had to spend quite a bit of time finding 519 00:16:11,430 --> 00:16:12,059 a taxi 520 00:16:12,060 --> 00:16:14,159 driver who knew where 521 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:15,449 this road was. This road 522 00:16:15,450 --> 00:16:17,639 had been so dangerous for so long 523 00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:19,859 that you wouldn't people 524 00:16:19,860 --> 00:16:21,929 from before we had to find someone who'd 525 00:16:21,930 --> 00:16:23,939 been driving a cab since before 526 00:16:23,940 --> 00:16:24,629 the Soviet 527 00:16:24,630 --> 00:16:27,059 occupation of Afghanistan. 528 00:16:27,060 --> 00:16:29,299 So all of our 529 00:16:29,300 --> 00:16:29,999 our fixer 530 00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:31,409 goes, We need to find the old man. 531 00:16:31,410 --> 00:16:32,699 You know, someone who knows where this 532 00:16:32,700 --> 00:16:35,279 road that you're talking about is to 533 00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:37,319 start driving out there and you leave the 534 00:16:37,320 --> 00:16:39,419 city behind you and 535 00:16:39,420 --> 00:16:40,499 you know, you're kind of out in the 536 00:16:40,500 --> 00:16:42,569 sticks in Afghanistan and we 537 00:16:42,570 --> 00:16:44,309 end up in a traffic jam. 538 00:16:44,310 --> 00:16:45,389 But it's not a bunch of cars. 539 00:16:45,390 --> 00:16:45,929 It's a herd of 540 00:16:45,930 --> 00:16:48,119 goats going across the street waiting for 541 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:48,569 these goats 542 00:16:48,570 --> 00:16:49,679 to go by. 543 00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:50,999 And we see the shepherd, 544 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:53,189 very old man, you know, the traditional 545 00:16:53,190 --> 00:16:54,869 Afghan clothes and the whole thing, big 546 00:16:54,870 --> 00:16:55,439 beard 547 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:57,209 exactly what you'd picture in your head. 548 00:16:57,210 --> 00:16:58,559 But we know just, hey, this guy, this 549 00:16:58,560 --> 00:16:58,979 shepherd, 550 00:16:58,980 --> 00:17:01,169 he's wearing a baseball hat. 551 00:17:01,170 --> 00:17:02,170 That's weird. 552 00:17:03,030 --> 00:17:03,419 Waiting for 553 00:17:03,420 --> 00:17:05,159 him to go by the shepherd finally turns 554 00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:06,989 to look at us in the car 555 00:17:06,990 --> 00:17:08,159 wearing a black baseball hat. 556 00:17:08,160 --> 00:17:09,858 The letters KBR 557 00:17:09,859 --> 00:17:11,039 are on that baseball 558 00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:13,108 hat. KBR stands for something called 559 00:17:13,109 --> 00:17:13,618 Kellogg, 560 00:17:13,619 --> 00:17:15,838 Brown and Root, which is a company 561 00:17:15,839 --> 00:17:17,669 that was a subsidiary of another company 562 00:17:17,670 --> 00:17:19,739 called Halliburton, which of course, 563 00:17:19,740 --> 00:17:21,809 was the company that Dick Cheney was 564 00:17:22,980 --> 00:17:24,269 on the board of. 565 00:17:24,270 --> 00:17:25,709 And so here we are in the middle of 566 00:17:25,710 --> 00:17:27,868 nowhere Afghanistan next to what we 567 00:17:27,869 --> 00:17:29,969 are ninety nine point ninety 568 00:17:29,970 --> 00:17:31,979 nine percent positive is a secret CIA 569 00:17:31,980 --> 00:17:34,289 prison. The local goat herder is wearing 570 00:17:34,290 --> 00:17:35,689 a Dick Cheney baseball hat. 571 00:17:43,430 --> 00:17:44,899 This is another black site 572 00:17:44,900 --> 00:17:46,460 also in Kabul. 573 00:17:47,690 --> 00:17:50,059 Now when you were, I'm really interested 574 00:17:50,060 --> 00:17:51,869 in this front companies and because of 575 00:17:51,870 --> 00:17:53,539 what I'm interested in as a want to 576 00:17:53,540 --> 00:17:55,339 understand what is the domestic 577 00:17:55,340 --> 00:17:57,499 architecture of a covert operation like 578 00:17:57,500 --> 00:17:59,029 this look like? What does it look like at 579 00:17:59,030 --> 00:18:00,769 home? What does it look like? 580 00:18:00,770 --> 00:18:01,719 You know, just 581 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:02,779 what we 582 00:18:02,780 --> 00:18:05,059 all imagined covert operations 583 00:18:05,060 --> 00:18:07,579 being secret prisons and gruesome 584 00:18:07,580 --> 00:18:08,989 scenes of torture and that sort of thing. 585 00:18:08,990 --> 00:18:09,979 And that's all true. 586 00:18:09,980 --> 00:18:11,719 But I wanted to understand what also 587 00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:12,619 facilitates that. 588 00:18:12,620 --> 00:18:14,509 What is the other kinds of architecture 589 00:18:14,510 --> 00:18:15,739 that enable that? 590 00:18:15,740 --> 00:18:17,809 And we've got a huge glimpse into that a 591 00:18:17,810 --> 00:18:19,879 couple of years ago when two of 592 00:18:19,880 --> 00:18:21,889 these front companies, so these front 593 00:18:21,890 --> 00:18:24,199 companies are there, 594 00:18:24,200 --> 00:18:25,879 they're sort of in this gray zone 595 00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:27,469 sometimes where they do real work and 596 00:18:27,470 --> 00:18:28,939 they're real businesses and they have, 597 00:18:28,940 --> 00:18:31,009 you know, you know, cash flows and things 598 00:18:31,010 --> 00:18:32,149 like that. 599 00:18:32,150 --> 00:18:33,889 But they're also primarily doing work for 600 00:18:33,890 --> 00:18:35,059 the CIA. 601 00:18:35,060 --> 00:18:36,889 So what happened was two of these front 602 00:18:36,890 --> 00:18:39,169 companies got in a billing dispute 603 00:18:40,220 --> 00:18:42,259 over invoices, unpaid invoices for 604 00:18:42,260 --> 00:18:43,579 rendition flights. 605 00:18:43,580 --> 00:18:45,259 And one of the companies was this company 606 00:18:45,260 --> 00:18:47,329 here, Rich Moore Aviation. 607 00:18:47,330 --> 00:18:48,559 The other company was a company called 608 00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:50,629 Sports Flight Airways, and this 609 00:18:50,630 --> 00:18:52,999 is a company that does organizes 610 00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:55,189 charter airplanes for sports 611 00:18:55,190 --> 00:18:56,690 teams and the CIA. 612 00:18:59,500 --> 00:19:01,759 I'm not making this up. 613 00:19:01,760 --> 00:19:03,919 So anyway, this lawsuit, because 614 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:05,419 both of the companies were located in New 615 00:19:05,420 --> 00:19:07,339 York, the lawsuit ended up going down in 616 00:19:07,340 --> 00:19:09,409 the district court in a small court 617 00:19:09,410 --> 00:19:11,899 in New York, and nobody noticed 618 00:19:11,900 --> 00:19:13,219 that this thing had happened for like 619 00:19:13,220 --> 00:19:13,639 three 620 00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:16,369 years, including the CIA, 621 00:19:16,370 --> 00:19:17,989 who didn't bother. 622 00:19:17,990 --> 00:19:19,939 Nobody, you know, notice that this 623 00:19:19,940 --> 00:19:21,409 lawsuit was happening, so nobody invoked 624 00:19:21,410 --> 00:19:22,759 the state secrets privilege. 625 00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:23,989 Nobody got it thrown out of court. 626 00:19:23,990 --> 00:19:26,179 So this crazy thing that happened, 627 00:19:26,180 --> 00:19:28,339 so there ended up being depositions 628 00:19:28,340 --> 00:19:30,409 and, you know, evidentiary 629 00:19:30,410 --> 00:19:31,579 findings in that sort of thing. 630 00:19:31,580 --> 00:19:33,319 Just thousands of documents were 631 00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:35,539 generated. And these people 632 00:19:35,540 --> 00:19:37,549 at the human rights group reprieve in the 633 00:19:37,550 --> 00:19:39,739 U.K. got their hands on this stuff 634 00:19:39,740 --> 00:19:41,359 and I got it from them. 635 00:19:41,360 --> 00:19:44,119 And in these documents, you find invoices 636 00:19:44,120 --> 00:19:45,409 for rendition flights. 637 00:19:45,410 --> 00:19:47,179 This is a fight. Washington, Guantanamo 638 00:19:47,180 --> 00:19:47,449 Bay, 639 00:19:47,450 --> 00:19:49,159 Bucharest robot, 640 00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:50,160 you know, 641 00:19:50,570 --> 00:19:52,279 without the bill is one hundred sixty 642 00:19:52,280 --> 00:19:54,439 five thousand dollars, something 643 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:56,539 you know, Eurocontrol 644 00:19:56,540 --> 00:19:59,389 documents invoices 645 00:19:59,390 --> 00:19:59,659 for 646 00:19:59,660 --> 00:20:01,879 telephone calls that were made 647 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:03,949 during the in-flight telephone calls 648 00:20:03,950 --> 00:20:06,169 that these guys were making back home 649 00:20:06,170 --> 00:20:07,909 to to headquarters 650 00:20:07,910 --> 00:20:09,259 or whatever it was. These guys are trying 651 00:20:09,260 --> 00:20:10,849 to get reimbursed for these satellite 652 00:20:10,850 --> 00:20:11,850 phone bills. 653 00:20:13,290 --> 00:20:14,309 Depositions. 654 00:20:15,970 --> 00:20:18,039 And so I spent a long time 655 00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:19,119 with all this stuff and just started 656 00:20:19,120 --> 00:20:21,249 making this giant map, just trying 657 00:20:21,250 --> 00:20:23,079 to understand what all of the different 658 00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:25,269 relationships were that were being 659 00:20:25,270 --> 00:20:28,149 outlined in these in these documents. 660 00:20:28,150 --> 00:20:30,039 Turns out Dying Core was one of the big 661 00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:31,539 people behind it. But then even a 662 00:20:31,540 --> 00:20:33,069 dinosaur found out the names of different 663 00:20:33,070 --> 00:20:34,659 managers for parts of the program. 664 00:20:34,660 --> 00:20:35,660 That sort of thing. 665 00:20:36,820 --> 00:20:38,919 You know, sports flight was at the center 666 00:20:38,920 --> 00:20:39,639 of it. 667 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:41,859 And the sports site was also charting 668 00:20:41,860 --> 00:20:42,909 with this other 669 00:20:42,910 --> 00:20:44,889 whole other bunch of companies also doing 670 00:20:44,890 --> 00:20:46,329 rendition flights as well that we didn't 671 00:20:46,330 --> 00:20:47,330 know about. 672 00:20:48,730 --> 00:20:50,169 And I just started going around and 673 00:20:50,170 --> 00:20:51,789 photographing these places I wanted to 674 00:20:51,790 --> 00:20:52,719 understand. 675 00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:53,649 I wanted to see 676 00:20:53,650 --> 00:20:55,179 the places that we're talking about in 677 00:20:55,180 --> 00:20:56,169 these documents. 678 00:20:56,170 --> 00:20:58,269 Here's sports flight in Long Island. 679 00:20:58,270 --> 00:20:59,949 It kind of had a failed attempt to try to 680 00:20:59,950 --> 00:21:01,420 tape over the name of their sign 681 00:21:03,550 --> 00:21:04,509 in the depositions. 682 00:21:04,510 --> 00:21:05,859 You have stuff like this who you know 683 00:21:05,860 --> 00:21:08,349 who? Ron Dickey is the backup program 684 00:21:08,350 --> 00:21:10,359 manager of supporting Bill Vigil. 685 00:21:10,360 --> 00:21:11,379 I wanted to know what Bill 686 00:21:11,380 --> 00:21:13,239 Vigil looked like, so I sat outside his 687 00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:14,240 house. 688 00:21:20,980 --> 00:21:22,420 Here's Ron Dickey. 689 00:21:25,470 --> 00:21:27,509 Yeah, it was it was 690 00:21:27,510 --> 00:21:28,409 one of their talking about another 691 00:21:28,410 --> 00:21:29,849 company called 692 00:21:29,850 --> 00:21:32,099 the International 693 00:21:32,100 --> 00:21:33,629 Group or something in Hauts 694 00:21:33,630 --> 00:21:34,979 Head's New York, U.S. 695 00:21:34,980 --> 00:21:36,779 Aviation, blah blah blah prime jet in 696 00:21:36,780 --> 00:21:38,759 California just wanted to see 697 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:40,079 where these places were. 698 00:21:42,930 --> 00:21:44,849 The only Larry I know is Larry SEALs, I 699 00:21:44,850 --> 00:21:45,869 never met him, do you know if he's 700 00:21:45,870 --> 00:21:47,489 employed by anybody as far as I know the 701 00:21:47,490 --> 00:21:48,899 State Department? 702 00:21:48,900 --> 00:21:50,099 One note he look like 703 00:21:52,470 --> 00:21:54,749 what this all adds up to is 704 00:21:54,750 --> 00:21:56,819 what I think of as a very everyday 705 00:21:56,820 --> 00:21:58,439 landscape. 706 00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:00,869 So we're looking at an incredibly 707 00:22:00,870 --> 00:22:03,899 secret, incredibly, in my opinion, evil, 708 00:22:03,900 --> 00:22:05,759 covert operation and what does it look 709 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:07,479 like? It doesn't look like anything. 710 00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:08,189 It looks like 711 00:22:08,190 --> 00:22:08,849 the rest of the 712 00:22:08,850 --> 00:22:11,129 world that's around us all of the time. 713 00:22:11,130 --> 00:22:12,269 And for me, there's something actually 714 00:22:12,270 --> 00:22:13,589 quite terrifying about that. 715 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:17,359 Other contradictions. 716 00:22:18,780 --> 00:22:20,939 Places to find covert 717 00:22:20,940 --> 00:22:22,259 activities. 718 00:22:22,260 --> 00:22:23,669 Places to see secrecy 719 00:22:23,670 --> 00:22:25,109 where you don't have to go far at all, 720 00:22:25,110 --> 00:22:27,239 you can step outside and look up in 721 00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:28,229 the sky. 722 00:22:28,230 --> 00:22:30,359 In the end, there's many ways that I that 723 00:22:30,360 --> 00:22:32,489 I do that I've spent a lot of time 724 00:22:32,490 --> 00:22:33,509 out in Nevada. 725 00:22:33,510 --> 00:22:35,639 All of the drones, pretty much in the 726 00:22:35,640 --> 00:22:37,349 world, are flown by pilots based in 727 00:22:37,350 --> 00:22:39,719 Nevada, north northwest 728 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:40,679 of Las Vegas. 729 00:22:40,680 --> 00:22:42,839 You drive about an hour out into the 730 00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:44,189 desert and there's a little air force 731 00:22:44,190 --> 00:22:45,299 base out in the desert called 732 00:22:45,300 --> 00:22:46,889 Creech Air Force Base. 733 00:22:46,890 --> 00:22:48,239 And you kind of even have to know that 734 00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:49,240 it's there. 735 00:22:49,980 --> 00:22:51,629 And what you do is you go out there and 736 00:22:51,630 --> 00:22:53,789 you park your car and just look 737 00:22:53,790 --> 00:22:55,319 up at the sky. 738 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:56,729 You look up at the sky and it takes a 739 00:22:56,730 --> 00:22:58,019 minute or so for your eyes to adjust. 740 00:22:58,020 --> 00:23:00,029 And then you realize 741 00:23:00,030 --> 00:23:00,449 there's all of 742 00:23:00,450 --> 00:23:01,859 these little things that look like 743 00:23:01,860 --> 00:23:03,359 insects flying around. 744 00:23:03,360 --> 00:23:05,519 And what it is is you're seeing drones. 745 00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:07,409 And so I've spent a lot of time out there 746 00:23:07,410 --> 00:23:09,839 just photographing the sky generally 747 00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:11,219 early in the morning. 748 00:23:11,220 --> 00:23:12,869 So you have these Big Sky escapes, and 749 00:23:12,870 --> 00:23:14,189 when you look a little bit closer, you 750 00:23:14,190 --> 00:23:16,259 find these little, you know, guys in 751 00:23:16,260 --> 00:23:17,939 there that don't belong. 752 00:23:17,940 --> 00:23:19,589 A few months ago, I saw something very 753 00:23:19,590 --> 00:23:21,239 remarkable out there. 754 00:23:25,930 --> 00:23:27,219 It's something I'm not sure anybody's 755 00:23:27,220 --> 00:23:27,759 ever seen one 756 00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:29,919 of these, and not just flying 757 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:32,169 around before this, I'm pretty sure 758 00:23:32,170 --> 00:23:34,719 this is one of these are que 759 00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:36,849 170 sentinel drones. 760 00:23:38,620 --> 00:23:39,969 And it's the weirdest sound. 761 00:23:39,970 --> 00:23:41,829 It sounds like a tiny plane or something 762 00:23:41,830 --> 00:23:42,999 like that once flying like. 763 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:52,099 This, of course, was the drone that the 764 00:23:52,100 --> 00:23:54,049 Iranians managed to bring down a couple 765 00:23:54,050 --> 00:23:55,050 of years ago. 766 00:23:57,200 --> 00:23:58,819 And, yeah, so did 767 00:23:58,820 --> 00:24:00,589 these kind of sky gave some really. 768 00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:07,769 But when I'm looking at this stuff, I'm 769 00:24:07,770 --> 00:24:09,839 not just looking to see like 770 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:10,919 there's a drone, I'm trying to 771 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:13,229 understand. What is it kind of look like 772 00:24:13,230 --> 00:24:15,149 historically and I'm thinking about what 773 00:24:15,150 --> 00:24:17,459 kind of images do 774 00:24:17,460 --> 00:24:19,439 these kinds of things perhaps rhyme with 775 00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:21,479 throughout the history of images? 776 00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:23,699 I spend way too much time thinking about 777 00:24:23,700 --> 00:24:25,889 Turner, and this is Turner 778 00:24:25,890 --> 00:24:27,929 Turner's painting an angel in the Sun 779 00:24:27,930 --> 00:24:29,809 from the the mid-19th century. 780 00:24:29,810 --> 00:24:30,719 I'm trying to think about, Well, what 781 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:32,429 does that look like now? 782 00:24:32,430 --> 00:24:32,999 Perhaps it 783 00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:33,899 looks like the 784 00:24:33,900 --> 00:24:35,099 Reaper in the Sun. 785 00:24:35,100 --> 00:24:36,509 And of course, you can't see the Reaper 786 00:24:36,510 --> 00:24:38,279 in here because it's like really that big 787 00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:39,280 on the giant print. 788 00:24:40,860 --> 00:24:42,419 I also spent a lot of time looking at the 789 00:24:42,420 --> 00:24:44,579 night sky and particularly what 790 00:24:44,580 --> 00:24:47,189 I'm looking for and what I'm doing is 791 00:24:47,190 --> 00:24:49,319 tracking satellites and tracking 792 00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:50,909 classified satellites, 793 00:24:50,910 --> 00:24:53,129 tracking objects in the sky that, 794 00:24:53,130 --> 00:24:55,199 you know, aren't there as it 795 00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:56,639 were for for political 796 00:24:56,640 --> 00:24:58,379 reasons, you know, for all the secret 797 00:24:58,380 --> 00:25:00,209 things in the sky. 798 00:25:00,210 --> 00:25:01,949 And it turns out, you know, we're on this 799 00:25:01,950 --> 00:25:03,839 theme of contradictions, right? 800 00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:05,699 That that you hate that stuff. 801 00:25:05,700 --> 00:25:07,919 Secret stuff is made of the same stuff 802 00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:09,689 that that everything else in the world is 803 00:25:09,690 --> 00:25:11,639 made out of in the same is true of some 804 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:13,139 of the most, you know, classified 805 00:25:13,140 --> 00:25:15,029 machines in the world, which are above 806 00:25:15,030 --> 00:25:16,439 our heads in the night sky. 807 00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:18,329 They all have to obey Kepler's 808 00:25:18,330 --> 00:25:20,369 laws of planetary motion. 809 00:25:20,370 --> 00:25:22,859 So if you put something in 810 00:25:22,860 --> 00:25:25,739 in orbit around the Earth 811 00:25:25,740 --> 00:25:26,939 and you can get a couple of good 812 00:25:26,940 --> 00:25:29,219 observations of it, you can very, 813 00:25:29,220 --> 00:25:31,319 very accurately model its 814 00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:33,119 orbit and you can predict where 815 00:25:33,120 --> 00:25:35,609 it will be to a high degree of accuracy. 816 00:25:35,610 --> 00:25:36,779 And there's a group of amateur 817 00:25:36,780 --> 00:25:38,279 astronomers around the world, about a 818 00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:39,569 dozen guys who are really good 819 00:25:39,570 --> 00:25:40,589 at this, 820 00:25:40,590 --> 00:25:42,389 who this is what they do every night and 821 00:25:42,390 --> 00:25:44,519 they go out with binoculars and 822 00:25:44,520 --> 00:25:46,499 telescopes and that sort of thing and 823 00:25:46,500 --> 00:25:48,569 measure the locations 824 00:25:48,570 --> 00:25:50,309 of reconnaissance spacecraft. 825 00:25:50,310 --> 00:25:51,959 And so you get numbers like this, this 826 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:53,399 is called a tele or 827 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:54,629 a two line element. 828 00:25:54,630 --> 00:25:55,919 It's a series of numbers 829 00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:58,799 that describe the orbit of a spacecraft. 830 00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:00,419 And you can go and you know, there's 831 00:26:00,420 --> 00:26:02,159 various software applications where you 832 00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:04,559 can kind of plug your tele file 833 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:06,899 into a basically a sky chart 834 00:26:06,900 --> 00:26:08,489 and you can predict where something will 835 00:26:08,490 --> 00:26:10,559 be in the sky once you 836 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:12,089 predict where it will be in the sky. 837 00:26:12,090 --> 00:26:14,009 You can go out and try to photograph 838 00:26:14,010 --> 00:26:15,779 these things. Now this is a lot easier 839 00:26:15,780 --> 00:26:16,780 said than done 840 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:19,319 trying to point, you know, photograph a 841 00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:21,299 little tiny point of light. 842 00:26:21,300 --> 00:26:21,959 This is 843 00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:22,919 a photograph of 844 00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:25,109 a of a system that, thanks to Ed Snowden, 845 00:26:25,110 --> 00:26:27,539 we know it's called a keyhole enhanced 846 00:26:27,540 --> 00:26:28,979 crystal system. 847 00:26:28,980 --> 00:26:30,869 This is basically like an evil twin of 848 00:26:30,870 --> 00:26:32,759 the Hubble Space Telescope that's pointed 849 00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:34,679 down at Earth, and there's a whole bunch 850 00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:36,149 of these things. 851 00:26:36,150 --> 00:26:37,829 And what you're seeing here, that line in 852 00:26:37,830 --> 00:26:39,629 the middle of the image is the spacecraft 853 00:26:39,630 --> 00:26:41,579 moving through the frame over the course 854 00:26:41,580 --> 00:26:42,779 of a long exposure. 855 00:26:42,780 --> 00:26:44,399 And the reason this is so orange is that 856 00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:46,589 you're seeing this is shot from the city. 857 00:26:46,590 --> 00:26:49,169 So you're seeing the street lights and 858 00:26:49,170 --> 00:26:51,179 noise pollution bouncing off low clouds. 859 00:26:54,120 --> 00:26:56,489 Do you see strange things in the sky? 860 00:26:56,490 --> 00:26:57,839 This is an image of a 861 00:26:57,840 --> 00:26:58,859 spacecraft called 862 00:26:58,860 --> 00:27:00,779 Pan that was launched a few 863 00:27:00,780 --> 00:27:02,279 years ago p.a. 864 00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:03,989 and and it was launched into a 865 00:27:03,990 --> 00:27:05,409 geostationary orbit. 866 00:27:05,410 --> 00:27:06,599 That's an orbit 867 00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:08,279 that looks like this very, very far away. 868 00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:09,449 So it basically 869 00:27:09,450 --> 00:27:10,979 orbits around the Earth at the same rate 870 00:27:10,980 --> 00:27:11,219 that the 871 00:27:11,220 --> 00:27:13,409 Earth itself is rotating. 872 00:27:13,410 --> 00:27:15,479 And Pan was very, very strange 873 00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:16,529 for a couple of reasons. 874 00:27:17,670 --> 00:27:19,949 It right here. It's this little 875 00:27:19,950 --> 00:27:21,480 dot, obviously, 876 00:27:22,920 --> 00:27:23,920 and 877 00:27:24,990 --> 00:27:26,699 I had to actually fly to South Africa to 878 00:27:26,700 --> 00:27:27,059 take this 879 00:27:27,060 --> 00:27:29,249 picture because pans over the Indian 880 00:27:29,250 --> 00:27:31,229 Ocean, but pan. 881 00:27:31,230 --> 00:27:33,239 So normally there's all kinds of spy 882 00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:34,829 satellites and classified launches that 883 00:27:34,830 --> 00:27:37,019 are happening in every single 884 00:27:37,020 --> 00:27:38,969 case. A classified launch will either 885 00:27:38,970 --> 00:27:40,289 have a military launch, no. 886 00:27:40,290 --> 00:27:41,339 Or what's called a National 887 00:27:41,340 --> 00:27:42,719 Reconnaissance Office launch? 888 00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:45,179 No. So the military will always announce 889 00:27:45,180 --> 00:27:46,859 when they're launching some when they're 890 00:27:46,860 --> 00:27:47,849 going to launch a rocket because they 891 00:27:47,850 --> 00:27:49,339 don't want to think the Russians that 892 00:27:49,340 --> 00:27:51,209 they're starting, you know, next World 893 00:27:51,210 --> 00:27:52,469 War or something like that. 894 00:27:52,470 --> 00:27:54,089 So I say we're launching a rocket. 895 00:27:54,090 --> 00:27:55,559 Here's the NROL. 896 00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:56,519 No. 897 00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:58,219 It's going to be around this day and 898 00:27:58,220 --> 00:28:00,119 around this time. 899 00:28:00,120 --> 00:28:02,489 This thing, called Pan Pan, 900 00:28:02,490 --> 00:28:04,439 shows up on the launch manifest and does 901 00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:05,249 not show 902 00:28:05,250 --> 00:28:06,929 shows up as a classified payload, 903 00:28:06,930 --> 00:28:08,939 but does not have a narrow launch number 904 00:28:08,940 --> 00:28:10,559 and does not have a military launch 905 00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:11,219 number. 906 00:28:11,220 --> 00:28:12,809 So what the hell is this thing? 907 00:28:14,100 --> 00:28:15,209 There's a patch for it, 908 00:28:15,210 --> 00:28:18,629 says Pan Palladium at night, 909 00:28:18,630 --> 00:28:21,329 but word on the street was that Pan just 910 00:28:21,330 --> 00:28:22,349 stood for pick 911 00:28:22,350 --> 00:28:23,350 a name 912 00:28:26,010 --> 00:28:27,119 in the patch as this rocket 913 00:28:27,120 --> 00:28:29,339 going off very faintly in the smoke below 914 00:28:29,340 --> 00:28:30,959 the rocket, you see this question mark. 915 00:28:32,220 --> 00:28:34,439 So pan goes up and turns out later 916 00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:36,119 there's a little Lockheed brochure that 917 00:28:36,120 --> 00:28:38,309 mentioned in passing that that pan 918 00:28:38,310 --> 00:28:40,649 was based on what I believe a Lockheed 919 00:28:40,650 --> 00:28:42,509 A220 800 bus. 920 00:28:42,510 --> 00:28:43,919 So. So it's basically a kind of 921 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:45,749 communication satellite goes into this 922 00:28:45,750 --> 00:28:47,849 geostationary orbit 923 00:28:47,850 --> 00:28:49,739 over the Indian Ocean and just sits 924 00:28:49,740 --> 00:28:51,869 there. And so what the hell is this 925 00:28:51,870 --> 00:28:54,389 thing? What if it's not got an NROL 926 00:28:54,390 --> 00:28:55,319 or a military launch? 927 00:28:55,320 --> 00:28:57,989 No. Then presumably it's 928 00:28:57,990 --> 00:29:00,209 another government agency 929 00:29:00,210 --> 00:29:02,049 that would have this communication 930 00:29:02,050 --> 00:29:03,839 satellite over the Indian Ocean 931 00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:04,739 so 932 00:29:04,740 --> 00:29:06,059 that. This point, I'm just making up 933 00:29:06,060 --> 00:29:08,009 conspiracy theories, the first idea that 934 00:29:08,010 --> 00:29:09,779 I had with some other people was that, 935 00:29:09,780 --> 00:29:11,759 OK, who would want to have a whole lot of 936 00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:13,619 bandwidth over the Indian Ocean? 937 00:29:13,620 --> 00:29:14,729 Who's not the NRA? 938 00:29:14,730 --> 00:29:15,689 Who's not NSA? 939 00:29:15,690 --> 00:29:17,159 Who's not the military? 940 00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:19,889 We started to think, OK, maybe CIA. 941 00:29:19,890 --> 00:29:21,929 So on the other agency that I could think 942 00:29:21,930 --> 00:29:23,339 of and say it doesn't put their name on 943 00:29:23,340 --> 00:29:25,589 anything. So we thought, why 944 00:29:25,590 --> 00:29:27,689 would the CIA want to have like a whole 945 00:29:27,690 --> 00:29:29,389 lot of bandwidth over the Indian Ocean? 946 00:29:29,390 --> 00:29:30,809 The first thing you might think of as 947 00:29:30,810 --> 00:29:32,189 maybe they want to talk to their guys 948 00:29:32,190 --> 00:29:33,209 around the world? 949 00:29:33,210 --> 00:29:34,949 But that's way overkill to have a 950 00:29:34,950 --> 00:29:37,019 dedicated communication satellite to do 951 00:29:37,020 --> 00:29:39,179 that. So the second thought was thinking 952 00:29:39,180 --> 00:29:39,809 about, 953 00:29:39,810 --> 00:29:41,309 well, actually, 954 00:29:41,310 --> 00:29:43,139 let's think about what's going on here 955 00:29:43,140 --> 00:29:44,759 because there's two drone wars. 956 00:29:44,760 --> 00:29:46,559 There's the military one that places, you 957 00:29:46,560 --> 00:29:48,719 know, in kind of active battlefields 958 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:51,209 like Iraq and Afghanistan 959 00:29:51,210 --> 00:29:53,789 and so on. But all of the drones 960 00:29:53,790 --> 00:29:55,349 assassinations that are going on in 961 00:29:55,350 --> 00:29:58,139 places like Pakistan, Yemen 962 00:29:58,140 --> 00:30:00,839 and so forth are run by the CIA. 963 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:02,579 And CIA would definitely want to have a 964 00:30:02,580 --> 00:30:04,649 lot of bandwidth to to 965 00:30:04,650 --> 00:30:05,639 fly those things. 966 00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:07,259 The bandwidth on this spacecraft, I 967 00:30:07,260 --> 00:30:09,599 think, do 40 simultaneous drone missions, 968 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:10,589 something like that. 969 00:30:10,590 --> 00:30:11,849 So that was one theory. 970 00:30:11,850 --> 00:30:13,169 But that theory got a little bit more 971 00:30:13,170 --> 00:30:15,059 complicated because what Pan started 972 00:30:15,060 --> 00:30:17,279 doing was moving around 973 00:30:17,280 --> 00:30:19,589 the geostationary belt and parking 974 00:30:19,590 --> 00:30:21,599 itself within clusters of other 975 00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:23,219 communications satellites, 976 00:30:23,220 --> 00:30:25,679 which is highly, highly unusual 977 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:27,179 behavior because 978 00:30:27,180 --> 00:30:28,719 this burns up a lot of fuel and it 979 00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:29,639 dramatically 980 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:31,799 reduces the usable lifetime of your 981 00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:32,609 spacecraft. 982 00:30:32,610 --> 00:30:33,569 So what is pan? 983 00:30:33,570 --> 00:30:34,499 I don't know. 984 00:30:34,500 --> 00:30:36,389 Nobody knows. I mean, who knows what the 985 00:30:36,390 --> 00:30:38,459 hell this thing is one 986 00:30:38,460 --> 00:30:39,460 of those things. 987 00:30:41,100 --> 00:30:42,479 This is another weird little thing that 988 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:44,849 went up in 2009 on the Delta 989 00:30:44,850 --> 00:30:46,419 four heavy rocket. 990 00:30:46,420 --> 00:30:48,509 In January 2009, a 991 00:30:48,510 --> 00:30:51,119 gigantic NASA spacecraft 992 00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:53,639 went up again over the 993 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:55,709 Middle East and a friend of mine in 994 00:30:55,710 --> 00:30:57,179 South Africa and astronomers said, Hey 995 00:30:57,180 --> 00:30:57,539 Trevor, 996 00:30:57,540 --> 00:31:00,599 you should go take a look at USA 202, 997 00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:00,839 which 998 00:31:00,840 --> 00:31:02,579 was the name that we're that there was 999 00:31:02,580 --> 00:31:04,289 kind of publicly used for the thing 1000 00:31:04,290 --> 00:31:05,759 that, OK. 1001 00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:07,469 So I was out in the Eastern Hemisphere, a 1002 00:31:07,470 --> 00:31:08,609 place where I could see this thing and I 1003 00:31:08,610 --> 00:31:10,979 took this photograph and 1004 00:31:10,980 --> 00:31:11,519 USA 1005 00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:13,889 two or two, is 1006 00:31:13,890 --> 00:31:15,239 this thing right here, this really, 1007 00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:16,019 really bright light? 1008 00:31:16,020 --> 00:31:18,479 This is apparently one of the biggest, 1009 00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:20,729 heaviest, most expensive spacecraft 1010 00:31:20,730 --> 00:31:22,739 that the NASA and a row have ever made. 1011 00:31:22,740 --> 00:31:25,379 Supposedly, it has a giant antenna 1012 00:31:25,380 --> 00:31:26,939 about the size of a football 1013 00:31:26,940 --> 00:31:28,919 field, you know, a big umbrella shaped 1014 00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:30,209 antenna. 1015 00:31:30,210 --> 00:31:32,159 And I wrote back to my friend and said, 1016 00:31:32,160 --> 00:31:34,169 Yeah, I saw, you know, here's got this 1017 00:31:34,170 --> 00:31:35,609 picture of it. He's like, No, you're not. 1018 00:31:35,610 --> 00:31:36,749 You're not even pay attention to what 1019 00:31:36,750 --> 00:31:37,739 you're looking at, are you? And I was 1020 00:31:37,740 --> 00:31:38,669 like, What are you talking about? He was 1021 00:31:38,670 --> 00:31:41,009 like, Well, did you notice what it's next 1022 00:31:41,010 --> 00:31:43,529 to? And I hadn't thought about that, 1023 00:31:43,530 --> 00:31:44,339 even though it's right 1024 00:31:44,340 --> 00:31:45,299 there in the picture. 1025 00:31:45,300 --> 00:31:46,629 He said, Well, go, look that up. 1026 00:31:46,630 --> 00:31:48,779 And it turns out this little line here is 1027 00:31:48,780 --> 00:31:50,429 an unclassified spacecraft. 1028 00:31:50,430 --> 00:31:53,039 It's a spacecraft called 3A to 1029 00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:55,169 what the right to does is all 1030 00:31:55,170 --> 00:31:55,829 the satellite 1031 00:31:55,830 --> 00:31:57,419 telecommunications for the 1032 00:31:57,420 --> 00:31:58,420 Middle East. 1033 00:31:59,580 --> 00:32:00,580 How? 1034 00:32:02,610 --> 00:32:04,530 It's just right there, 1035 00:32:06,090 --> 00:32:07,410 see it through a telescope. 1036 00:32:09,900 --> 00:32:11,519 Anyway, there's other kinds of images 1037 00:32:11,520 --> 00:32:13,439 like this to have some fun with this, 1038 00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:14,909 every photographer has to have 1039 00:32:14,910 --> 00:32:17,069 their version of Yosemite, so my version 1040 00:32:17,070 --> 00:32:19,409 of Yosemite is photographing Yosemite 1041 00:32:19,410 --> 00:32:21,509 and you know, we've got a, 1042 00:32:21,510 --> 00:32:23,039 you know, one of these enhanced crystal 1043 00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:25,199 spacecraft in the sky photographing me 1044 00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:26,400 photographing Yosemite. 1045 00:32:35,210 --> 00:32:37,279 Yes, as we know from looking at all of 1046 00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:39,049 the Snowden documents, but we knew this 1047 00:32:39,050 --> 00:32:40,909 already, that secret societies are 1048 00:32:40,910 --> 00:32:41,329 obsessed 1049 00:32:41,330 --> 00:32:42,079 with symbols. 1050 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:43,189 This has always 1051 00:32:43,190 --> 00:32:45,199 been the case, going back to old Roman 1052 00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:46,759 mystery religions where they had these 1053 00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:48,859 elaborate, symbolic languages that were 1054 00:32:48,860 --> 00:32:51,109 sort of kind of elliptically 1055 00:32:51,110 --> 00:32:52,549 kind of trying to describe 1056 00:32:52,550 --> 00:32:54,709 the the secrets that these secret 1057 00:32:54,710 --> 00:32:55,909 societies held. 1058 00:32:55,910 --> 00:32:58,699 Well, the same turns out to be true for 1059 00:32:58,700 --> 00:33:00,199 parts of the military and the 1060 00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:01,849 intelligence community as well. 1061 00:33:01,850 --> 00:33:03,949 And you often find that in the form 1062 00:33:03,950 --> 00:33:04,159 of 1063 00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:05,089 patches that 1064 00:33:05,090 --> 00:33:07,099 people wear on their uniforms. 1065 00:33:07,100 --> 00:33:07,669 And it turns 1066 00:33:07,670 --> 00:33:09,169 out that there's all these black 1067 00:33:09,170 --> 00:33:10,999 projects in the military and intelligence 1068 00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:13,549 community, and they make uniform patches 1069 00:33:13,550 --> 00:33:14,550 for them. 1070 00:33:20,740 --> 00:33:22,689 And it's the damnedest thing, I mean, 1071 00:33:22,690 --> 00:33:24,099 I've asked a number of these guys, why 1072 00:33:24,100 --> 00:33:26,259 the hell are you making uniform patches 1073 00:33:26,260 --> 00:33:26,979 for black 1074 00:33:26,980 --> 00:33:28,659 projects? And they said, 1075 00:33:28,660 --> 00:33:29,799 Oh, well, if we 1076 00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:31,359 if we didn't have a patch, 1077 00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:33,519 that would really look weird, right? 1078 00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:34,520 OK. 1079 00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:38,910 So you find stuff like this. 1080 00:33:43,180 --> 00:33:45,289 The special projects 1081 00:33:45,290 --> 00:33:45,859 flight test 1082 00:33:45,860 --> 00:33:47,719 squadron, this is a unit they're 1083 00:33:47,720 --> 00:33:48,559 based at Area 1084 00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:50,119 51 in Nevada. 1085 00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:51,169 This famous secret 1086 00:33:51,170 --> 00:33:53,359 base and all they do 1087 00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:54,590 is fly secret airplanes 1088 00:33:55,910 --> 00:33:56,989 and their patch. 1089 00:33:56,990 --> 00:33:58,399 It has all these symbols and all mean 1090 00:33:58,400 --> 00:33:59,929 stuff. So here is this radar. 1091 00:33:59,930 --> 00:34:01,249 You have a generic airframe, you 1092 00:34:01,250 --> 00:34:02,209 have this sword here. 1093 00:34:02,210 --> 00:34:03,589 That sword actually refers to a 1094 00:34:03,590 --> 00:34:05,389 classified airframe that's now been 1095 00:34:05,390 --> 00:34:06,049 declassified, 1096 00:34:06,050 --> 00:34:07,699 codified, called bird of prey. 1097 00:34:07,700 --> 00:34:09,799 There this thing falling from 1098 00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:11,839 the sky is a radar calibration 1099 00:34:11,840 --> 00:34:13,519 target, so it's an aluminum ball with a 1100 00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:15,408 known radar cross-section that you throw 1101 00:34:15,409 --> 00:34:16,349 out the back of an airplane. 1102 00:34:16,350 --> 00:34:17,749 You use it to tune a radar. 1103 00:34:18,830 --> 00:34:21,649 Their mascot is this wizard with a staff. 1104 00:34:21,650 --> 00:34:23,658 The lightning bolt in the kind of visual 1105 00:34:23,659 --> 00:34:25,519 language of this stuff usually represents 1106 00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:27,678 electronic warfare. 1107 00:34:27,679 --> 00:34:29,869 He's holding this sigma symbol, 1108 00:34:29,870 --> 00:34:31,669 which when you do the when you're doing 1109 00:34:31,670 --> 00:34:33,859 the engineering equations to 1110 00:34:33,860 --> 00:34:35,718 design stealth aircraft. 1111 00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:36,439 This is 1112 00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,569 like the unknown kind of ideal 1113 00:34:38,570 --> 00:34:39,979 radar cross section. 1114 00:34:39,980 --> 00:34:42,948 This is like the goal of invisibility. 1115 00:34:42,949 --> 00:34:43,999 And then right here 1116 00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:46,069 you have a collection of five stars 1117 00:34:46,070 --> 00:34:48,289 and one off to the side five 1118 00:34:48,290 --> 00:34:50,749 one. These guys work at the famous 1119 00:34:50,750 --> 00:34:53,479 Area 51 secret base. 1120 00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:55,669 Now, based on our, you 1121 00:34:55,670 --> 00:34:57,109 know, like looking at these kind of 1122 00:34:57,110 --> 00:34:59,059 questions of logistics, you realize that, 1123 00:34:59,060 --> 00:35:00,649 you know, there's a huge amount of 1124 00:35:00,650 --> 00:35:02,419 infrastructure that has to go into 1125 00:35:02,420 --> 00:35:03,529 something like 1126 00:35:03,530 --> 00:35:04,759 the special projects 1127 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:05,689 flight test squadron. 1128 00:35:05,690 --> 00:35:07,879 If you want to have secret airplanes and 1129 00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:09,949 secret test pilots and the Secret Air 1130 00:35:09,950 --> 00:35:11,749 Base, then you need to have things like 1131 00:35:11,750 --> 00:35:13,459 secret air traffic controllers. 1132 00:35:13,460 --> 00:35:14,959 You need to have things like secret 1133 00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:17,089 maintenance crews down to the 1134 00:35:17,090 --> 00:35:18,499 point where you need to have secret 1135 00:35:18,500 --> 00:35:20,719 cafeteria people and secret janitor 1136 00:35:20,720 --> 00:35:22,549 people and secret doctors, you know, 1137 00:35:22,550 --> 00:35:24,679 flight surgeons and so on, and secret 1138 00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:26,689 data entry people into one zones on the 1139 00:35:26,690 --> 00:35:28,489 whole thing. If you're going to fly 1140 00:35:28,490 --> 00:35:30,619 secret airplanes, you need to 1141 00:35:30,620 --> 00:35:31,879 refuel them right. 1142 00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:33,229 And typically in the Air Force, the way 1143 00:35:33,230 --> 00:35:34,699 that you refuel the plane is with what's 1144 00:35:34,700 --> 00:35:35,929 called a tanker squadron. 1145 00:35:35,930 --> 00:35:38,029 You see you have a flying tanker in 1146 00:35:38,030 --> 00:35:39,709 your airplane, comes up and gets the gas 1147 00:35:39,710 --> 00:35:41,059 off. The tanker flies away. 1148 00:35:41,060 --> 00:35:42,709 So we're going to fly secret airplanes. 1149 00:35:42,710 --> 00:35:44,959 You need a secret tanker squadron. 1150 00:35:47,930 --> 00:35:49,999 Now this, they're the secret 1151 00:35:50,000 --> 00:35:51,349 tanker squadrons mascot. 1152 00:35:51,350 --> 00:35:52,459 Is this phantom guy. 1153 00:35:52,460 --> 00:35:53,899 The thing he's holding in his hand is a 1154 00:35:53,900 --> 00:35:54,829 tanker boom. 1155 00:35:54,830 --> 00:35:56,989 So it's like the boom that you lower 1156 00:35:56,990 --> 00:35:59,539 down into an airplane to refuel 1157 00:35:59,540 --> 00:36:00,540 it. 1158 00:36:00,770 --> 00:36:02,299 And then here at the bottom, we have this 1159 00:36:02,300 --> 00:36:03,289 it says N.K. 1160 00:36:03,290 --> 00:36:03,979 A.W. 1161 00:36:03,980 --> 00:36:06,199 T-G Dot Dot Dot 1162 00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:08,809 Nobody now and kW 1163 00:36:08,810 --> 00:36:10,819 tag is something it turns out you find on 1164 00:36:10,820 --> 00:36:12,739 all the patches for all the tanker 1165 00:36:12,740 --> 00:36:14,419 squadrons in the entire air 1166 00:36:14,420 --> 00:36:15,469 force 1167 00:36:15,470 --> 00:36:16,399 it stands for. 1168 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:17,389 No one kicks 1169 00:36:17,390 --> 00:36:19,579 ass without tanker gas. 1170 00:36:28,940 --> 00:36:30,619 You quickly start to build a whole 1171 00:36:30,620 --> 00:36:31,849 world when you're building secret 1172 00:36:31,850 --> 00:36:33,949 airplanes, this blew my mind when I found 1173 00:36:33,950 --> 00:36:35,509 out that somebody sent me this crap. 1174 00:36:35,510 --> 00:36:36,859 So it turns out you have all these secret 1175 00:36:36,860 --> 00:36:38,779 units, the special projects guys and the 1176 00:36:38,780 --> 00:36:41,089 secret flight tanker squadron guys. 1177 00:36:41,090 --> 00:36:43,339 They all have football teams 1178 00:36:43,340 --> 00:36:45,019 for their squadrons, 1179 00:36:45,020 --> 00:36:46,909 and they all play against the other 1180 00:36:46,910 --> 00:36:48,949 secret squadrons in the Secret 1181 00:36:48,950 --> 00:36:49,950 Football League. 1182 00:36:59,150 --> 00:37:00,619 So I got my hands on this good thing 1183 00:37:00,620 --> 00:37:01,939 right here, and this is 1184 00:37:01,940 --> 00:37:04,009 the ring for the 1185 00:37:04,010 --> 00:37:06,139 football team, for the red hats, 1186 00:37:06,140 --> 00:37:06,679 right? And the red 1187 00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:08,839 hats is another secret unit also 1188 00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:10,249 flying out of Area 51. 1189 00:37:10,250 --> 00:37:11,869 You got your five stars in one. 1190 00:37:11,870 --> 00:37:13,039 And their motto is 1191 00:37:13,040 --> 00:37:14,449 more with less. 1192 00:37:14,450 --> 00:37:16,639 And their mascot is a 1193 00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:17,599 bear 1194 00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:19,969 climbing over the world wearing a red 1195 00:37:19,970 --> 00:37:20,970 hat. 1196 00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:23,209 If you can guess what these 1197 00:37:23,210 --> 00:37:24,299 guys do, you're really good. 1198 00:37:24,300 --> 00:37:26,149 But I'll tell you what they do is they 1199 00:37:26,150 --> 00:37:28,429 fly a small squadron 1200 00:37:28,430 --> 00:37:30,559 of stolen Soviet and 1201 00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:32,959 Russian MiGs, right? 1202 00:37:32,960 --> 00:37:35,209 And their motto is more with less because 1203 00:37:35,210 --> 00:37:36,229 they only have a few of these 1204 00:37:36,230 --> 00:37:37,639 MiGs that they fly. 1205 00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:39,349 Now, I knew all these symbols. 1206 00:37:39,350 --> 00:37:40,699 I knew a lot about the Red Hat's 1207 00:37:40,700 --> 00:37:42,289 Antarctica had been in that squadron. 1208 00:37:42,290 --> 00:37:44,119 The guy who sent me this class ring, I 1209 00:37:44,120 --> 00:37:45,169 wrote back to him. I said, I know what 1210 00:37:45,170 --> 00:37:46,069 all these symbols mean, but there's 1211 00:37:46,070 --> 00:37:47,659 something I don't understand right here, 1212 00:37:47,660 --> 00:37:48,049 b 1213 00:37:48,050 --> 00:37:50,779 h, as I've never seen that before. 1214 00:37:50,780 --> 00:37:51,949 Can you tell me what that is? 1215 00:37:51,950 --> 00:37:54,259 And he said, Oh yeah, I'll tell you blue 1216 00:37:54,260 --> 00:37:55,670 hats. Ain't shit. 1217 00:38:00,470 --> 00:38:02,509 Rapid capabilities office, they got their 1218 00:38:02,510 --> 00:38:04,009 little black world 1219 00:38:04,010 --> 00:38:05,269 in in the background 1220 00:38:05,270 --> 00:38:06,270 of their patch. 1221 00:38:07,850 --> 00:38:09,889 These guys are these guys are in charge 1222 00:38:09,890 --> 00:38:11,059 of I don't know if you heard about this, 1223 00:38:11,060 --> 00:38:11,179 the 1224 00:38:11,180 --> 00:38:13,909 X-37B space plane. 1225 00:38:13,910 --> 00:38:15,529 So this is the Air Force has their own 1226 00:38:15,530 --> 00:38:17,599 little drone version of a 1227 00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:18,259 space shuttle. 1228 00:38:18,260 --> 00:38:19,699 That's secret. 1229 00:38:19,700 --> 00:38:21,429 That's flying around right now. 1230 00:38:21,430 --> 00:38:23,599 It's kind of a reusable vehicle. 1231 00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:24,859 I think it's on its third mission right 1232 00:38:24,860 --> 00:38:26,179 now that's been lasting forever. 1233 00:38:26,180 --> 00:38:28,639 Here's a photograph of it in the sky 1234 00:38:29,930 --> 00:38:32,029 the the flight crews for 1235 00:38:32,030 --> 00:38:33,109 the X-37B. 1236 00:38:33,110 --> 00:38:35,179 This their secret drone space shuttle. 1237 00:38:35,180 --> 00:38:36,180 This is their patch. 1238 00:38:42,870 --> 00:38:44,999 And they are all organized by they're 1239 00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:47,099 all working under this rapid capabilities 1240 00:38:47,100 --> 00:38:47,849 office. 1241 00:38:47,850 --> 00:38:48,329 The rapid 1242 00:38:48,330 --> 00:38:50,579 capabilities down office, down here, this 1243 00:38:50,580 --> 00:38:51,389 their little 1244 00:38:51,390 --> 00:38:53,129 slogan is 1245 00:38:53,130 --> 00:38:55,289 doing God's work with other 1246 00:38:55,290 --> 00:38:56,290 people's money. 1247 00:39:02,690 --> 00:39:04,039 You know, there's a lot a lot of times 1248 00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:05,809 you can learn operational details about 1249 00:39:05,810 --> 00:39:07,249 programs based on these patterns. 1250 00:39:07,250 --> 00:39:08,719 I mentioned that before this thing, this 1251 00:39:08,720 --> 00:39:08,989 is an 1252 00:39:08,990 --> 00:39:10,489 older patch for the 1253 00:39:10,490 --> 00:39:12,559 for one odd constellation 1254 00:39:12,560 --> 00:39:14,659 of spacecraft called Onyx that turns out 1255 00:39:14,660 --> 00:39:16,459 the orbital inclinations on this patch 1256 00:39:16,460 --> 00:39:16,609 are 1257 00:39:16,610 --> 00:39:17,509 accurate. 1258 00:39:17,510 --> 00:39:18,510 So you 1259 00:39:19,580 --> 00:39:21,769 so you could find out what you know where 1260 00:39:21,770 --> 00:39:22,549 this constellation 1261 00:39:22,550 --> 00:39:23,989 of secret spacecraft was, and you can 1262 00:39:23,990 --> 00:39:25,209 find out what they do this 1263 00:39:25,210 --> 00:39:26,269 the patch says. 1264 00:39:26,270 --> 00:39:27,979 We own the night and it has 1265 00:39:27,980 --> 00:39:30,109 this picture of allies 1266 00:39:30,110 --> 00:39:31,669 or a cat eyes or this 1267 00:39:31,670 --> 00:39:32,839 theme of seeing at night. 1268 00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:34,699 This is an imaging orbit, so they'll only 1269 00:39:34,700 --> 00:39:35,839 be in this orbit if you're taking 1270 00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:37,099 pictures, how are you going to take 1271 00:39:37,100 --> 00:39:38,479 pictures at night? 1272 00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:39,889 Will you do it with something called a 1273 00:39:39,890 --> 00:39:42,349 synthetic aperture radar? 1274 00:39:42,350 --> 00:39:45,379 And yeah, so 1275 00:39:45,380 --> 00:39:45,949 here's a picture 1276 00:39:45,950 --> 00:39:46,950 of that thing. 1277 00:39:47,660 --> 00:39:49,759 I publish this stuff that road. 1278 00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:51,349 There was a memo 1279 00:39:51,350 --> 00:39:52,939 saying, Hey, guys, stop putting 1280 00:39:52,940 --> 00:39:54,769 operational details of the classified 1281 00:39:54,770 --> 00:39:56,669 spacecraft into the patches. 1282 00:39:56,670 --> 00:39:58,249 Guys are on to us. 1283 00:39:58,250 --> 00:40:00,019 So the NRO 1284 00:40:00,020 --> 00:40:01,399 started having to make patches that look 1285 00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:02,400 like this. 1286 00:40:09,900 --> 00:40:11,879 This is for this launched a couple of 1287 00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:12,869 weeks ago. This is for 1288 00:40:12,870 --> 00:40:14,879 the second generation of this synthetic 1289 00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:16,919 aperture in our imaging spacecraft. 1290 00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:19,079 This one's called topaz. 1291 00:40:19,080 --> 00:40:21,029 This is an old favorite. 1292 00:40:21,030 --> 00:40:23,219 Let them hate so long as they 1293 00:40:23,220 --> 00:40:24,220 fear. 1294 00:40:26,510 --> 00:40:27,949 And this one kind of sums up the whole 1295 00:40:27,950 --> 00:40:28,950 thing. 1296 00:40:37,190 --> 00:40:39,439 This is for one of these spy 1297 00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:40,729 satellites that suck 1298 00:40:40,730 --> 00:40:43,229 up, you know, one of these NSA things. 1299 00:40:43,230 --> 00:40:44,510 The classic in the genre. 1300 00:40:46,610 --> 00:40:48,889 Don't ask none of your fucking 1301 00:40:48,890 --> 00:40:49,890 business. 1302 00:40:55,650 --> 00:40:57,569 And so I want to come back to this 1303 00:40:57,570 --> 00:40:59,699 original contradiction to 1304 00:40:59,700 --> 00:41:01,739 begin wrapping up here a little bit. 1305 00:41:01,740 --> 00:41:03,239 The idea that you know, when you you're 1306 00:41:03,240 --> 00:41:04,559 making, you're doing all this secret 1307 00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:06,539 stuff, it fits 1308 00:41:06,540 --> 00:41:08,429 imperfectly into the world. 1309 00:41:08,430 --> 00:41:10,649 You can't make invisible factories. 1310 00:41:10,650 --> 00:41:12,449 You can't, you know, you have to have 1311 00:41:12,450 --> 00:41:14,249 infrastructures that go into these covert 1312 00:41:14,250 --> 00:41:16,019 operations. Infrastructures generate 1313 00:41:16,020 --> 00:41:18,419 paperwork that generate, you know, 1314 00:41:18,420 --> 00:41:20,159 invoices and crap like that. 1315 00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:21,299 But they also 1316 00:41:21,300 --> 00:41:22,979 have a material footprint 1317 00:41:22,980 --> 00:41:24,789 on the Earth's surface. 1318 00:41:24,790 --> 00:41:25,409 Lot of 1319 00:41:25,410 --> 00:41:28,109 places that are, you know, associated 1320 00:41:28,110 --> 00:41:29,729 with classified activities, of course, 1321 00:41:29,730 --> 00:41:31,199 are all over the world. But there's a lot 1322 00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:33,509 in the West in particular that are way 1323 00:41:33,510 --> 00:41:34,259 out in the desert. 1324 00:41:34,260 --> 00:41:37,529 You can't get anywhere near these things. 1325 00:41:37,530 --> 00:41:39,629 Many times they'll have buffer zones of 1326 00:41:39,630 --> 00:41:42,029 30, 40, 50, 60 miles around 1327 00:41:42,030 --> 00:41:43,739 them. So there's literally no place that 1328 00:41:43,740 --> 00:41:45,869 you can stand on public land and see 1329 00:41:45,870 --> 00:41:47,879 them with your eyes in many cases. 1330 00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:50,069 So what I started doing was, 1331 00:41:50,070 --> 00:41:50,219 you 1332 00:41:50,220 --> 00:41:52,799 know, quite literally 1333 00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:55,049 using tools designed for astronomy 1334 00:41:55,050 --> 00:41:57,719 and astrophotography, trying to 1335 00:41:57,720 --> 00:41:59,969 use them for terrestrial photography, 1336 00:41:59,970 --> 00:42:02,039 asking myself if what 1337 00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:03,779 if I buy a telescope that's designed to 1338 00:42:03,780 --> 00:42:06,659 take a picture of the planet Jupiter 1339 00:42:06,660 --> 00:42:08,639 and try to take a picture of a military 1340 00:42:08,640 --> 00:42:10,529 base, you know, 40 miles away or so? 1341 00:42:10,530 --> 00:42:12,719 What happens would be like if in 1342 00:42:12,720 --> 00:42:14,459 a traditional landscape photograph like 1343 00:42:14,460 --> 00:42:15,959 an Ansel Adams is probably using 1344 00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:17,879 something like a 50 millimeter lens. 1345 00:42:17,880 --> 00:42:20,129 What happens if you use a 5000 millimeter 1346 00:42:20,130 --> 00:42:21,130 lens instead, 1347 00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:23,699 where you start to see a little bit 1348 00:42:23,700 --> 00:42:24,499 different, 1349 00:42:24,500 --> 00:42:25,860 little bit of a different landscape? 1350 00:42:33,580 --> 00:42:34,809 And these are what some of these images 1351 00:42:34,810 --> 00:42:36,969 look like, this is, you know, the Area 51 1352 00:42:36,970 --> 00:42:38,530 that's come up a couple of times here. 1353 00:42:40,060 --> 00:42:41,679 This is the the 1354 00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:43,869 massive the big data center that the NSA 1355 00:42:43,870 --> 00:42:45,609 is finishing up in Utah that keeps 1356 00:42:45,610 --> 00:42:47,709 blowing up. But this is what 1357 00:42:47,710 --> 00:42:49,239 this thing is. 1358 00:42:49,240 --> 00:42:52,269 This is a site in West Virginia 1359 00:42:52,270 --> 00:42:53,949 called the code. 1360 00:42:53,950 --> 00:42:55,689 Name of it is Timberline. 1361 00:42:55,690 --> 00:42:57,369 This is another one of these NSA 1362 00:42:57,370 --> 00:42:58,479 eavesdropping stations. 1363 00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:00,759 This is where most recently 1364 00:43:00,760 --> 00:43:02,529 they were involved in some of the spying 1365 00:43:02,530 --> 00:43:04,749 on UNICEF in the UN World Health 1366 00:43:04,750 --> 00:43:06,190 Program was going on from here. 1367 00:43:08,110 --> 00:43:10,359 This is the aerospace data facility 1368 00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:10,959 Southwest. 1369 00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:12,849 This is a downlink for reconnaissance 1370 00:43:12,850 --> 00:43:14,650 satellites in New Mexico. 1371 00:43:15,730 --> 00:43:17,679 Classified a classified airbase for 1372 00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:20,229 operational aircraft, also 1373 00:43:20,230 --> 00:43:21,339 in 1374 00:43:21,340 --> 00:43:22,329 Nevada. 1375 00:43:22,330 --> 00:43:24,429 This is taken from about 18 20 1376 00:43:24,430 --> 00:43:26,139 miles away. 1377 00:43:26,140 --> 00:43:28,389 When you start photographing these, these 1378 00:43:28,390 --> 00:43:29,979 kind of extreme distances, you're looking 1379 00:43:29,980 --> 00:43:31,839 through so much heat and so much haze 1380 00:43:31,840 --> 00:43:33,969 that the images, you know, start to break 1381 00:43:33,970 --> 00:43:35,949 down, quite literally. 1382 00:43:35,950 --> 00:43:37,809 And so in an image 1383 00:43:37,810 --> 00:43:38,859 like this, which 1384 00:43:38,860 --> 00:43:40,959 has taken him about 40 miles away, 1385 00:43:40,960 --> 00:43:42,879 these are chemical and biological weapons 1386 00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:44,799 proving grounds in Utah. 1387 00:43:44,800 --> 00:43:45,909 You start to 1388 00:43:45,910 --> 00:43:48,039 veer towards total 1389 00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:48,939 abstraction. 1390 00:43:48,940 --> 00:43:50,289 And so in an image 1391 00:43:50,290 --> 00:43:51,159 like this, 1392 00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:53,319 you're seeing two things it's an image 1393 00:43:53,320 --> 00:43:55,149 of a classified military base, 1394 00:43:55,150 --> 00:43:57,309 but it's also a photograph of 1395 00:43:57,310 --> 00:43:57,549 what 1396 00:43:57,550 --> 00:43:59,229 it looks like when you push 1397 00:43:59,230 --> 00:44:01,359 the physical properties of vision 1398 00:44:01,360 --> 00:44:04,539 so far that they just fall apart 1399 00:44:04,540 --> 00:44:05,829 at 60 miles. 1400 00:44:05,830 --> 00:44:07,900 You start to get stuff like this, 1401 00:44:09,100 --> 00:44:11,379 which looks like stuff like 1402 00:44:11,380 --> 00:44:12,380 this. 1403 00:44:17,670 --> 00:44:18,479 So just 1404 00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:20,379 to conclude, a 1405 00:44:20,380 --> 00:44:23,129 week ago, a couple of thoughts. 1406 00:44:23,130 --> 00:44:24,539 The world is 1407 00:44:24,540 --> 00:44:27,149 constantly changing and 1408 00:44:27,150 --> 00:44:27,719 I feel like 1409 00:44:27,720 --> 00:44:28,709 our job 1410 00:44:28,710 --> 00:44:31,439 or my job as an artist is try to see 1411 00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:33,869 how it's constantly changing. 1412 00:44:33,870 --> 00:44:35,249 And one of the things I've been thinking 1413 00:44:35,250 --> 00:44:37,589 a lot about are images like 1414 00:44:37,590 --> 00:44:39,779 this earlier today of Travis 1415 00:44:39,780 --> 00:44:42,059 Godspeed mentioned in passing that 1416 00:44:42,060 --> 00:44:43,589 there was a, you know, a couple of 1417 00:44:43,590 --> 00:44:45,059 years ago, there was a group of guys 1418 00:44:45,060 --> 00:44:46,409 who were pulling 1419 00:44:46,410 --> 00:44:47,789 video 1420 00:44:47,790 --> 00:44:49,919 links from drone flights around 1421 00:44:49,920 --> 00:44:52,109 the world off of on open 1422 00:44:52,110 --> 00:44:54,089 satellite channels of just regular 1423 00:44:54,090 --> 00:44:55,139 communication satellites. 1424 00:44:55,140 --> 00:44:56,579 I got my hands on some of this stuff and 1425 00:44:56,580 --> 00:44:58,019 made a little film out of it. 1426 00:44:58,020 --> 00:44:59,579 There's weird stuff that shows up in 1427 00:44:59,580 --> 00:45:00,569 these feeds, like one of 1428 00:45:00,570 --> 00:45:02,519 the recurring themes is this clock. 1429 00:45:02,520 --> 00:45:03,479 No idea why, 1430 00:45:03,480 --> 00:45:05,309 but guys who look at these feeds like 1431 00:45:05,310 --> 00:45:07,469 apparently it shows up from time to time. 1432 00:45:07,470 --> 00:45:09,389 But I think this kind of thing is 1433 00:45:09,390 --> 00:45:11,519 indicative of a larger thing that is 1434 00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:13,739 happening within the world of images 1435 00:45:13,740 --> 00:45:14,759 and within the visible 1436 00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:15,449 world 1437 00:45:15,450 --> 00:45:17,549 itself. And I think that images are 1438 00:45:17,550 --> 00:45:19,709 perhaps fundamentally 1439 00:45:19,710 --> 00:45:22,349 changing right now. 1440 00:45:22,350 --> 00:45:23,819 Traditionally, when we think about 1441 00:45:23,820 --> 00:45:25,229 images, the way the images have 1442 00:45:25,230 --> 00:45:26,699 functioned historically 1443 00:45:26,700 --> 00:45:27,929 as 1444 00:45:27,930 --> 00:45:30,149 they function, as representations, see 1445 00:45:30,150 --> 00:45:32,849 an image, it represents something 1446 00:45:32,850 --> 00:45:34,949 you know in the world, but more and more. 1447 00:45:34,950 --> 00:45:37,079 I think if if we haven't reached that 1448 00:45:37,080 --> 00:45:39,299 point yet, then we're quickly approaching 1449 00:45:39,300 --> 00:45:41,819 the point where the vast majority 1450 00:45:41,820 --> 00:45:43,859 of images and photographs made in the 1451 00:45:43,860 --> 00:45:46,049 world will be made by machines 1452 00:45:46,050 --> 00:45:48,089 for other machines, and humans will never 1453 00:45:48,090 --> 00:45:49,019 see them. 1454 00:45:49,020 --> 00:45:50,909 Although those images will do an 1455 00:45:50,910 --> 00:45:53,099 extraordinary image like an extraordinary 1456 00:45:53,100 --> 00:45:55,709 amount of work in actively sculpting 1457 00:45:55,710 --> 00:45:57,959 the world. And so we're moving away 1458 00:45:57,960 --> 00:46:00,089 from this regime of 1459 00:46:00,090 --> 00:46:02,189 images just being representational and 1460 00:46:02,190 --> 00:46:04,289 moving towards a kind of operational 1461 00:46:04,290 --> 00:46:05,429 regime of images. 1462 00:46:05,430 --> 00:46:06,929 And that's something that I'm trying to 1463 00:46:06,930 --> 00:46:07,739 think about 1464 00:46:07,740 --> 00:46:08,740 quite a lot. 1465 00:46:09,480 --> 00:46:11,670 I'll leave you with a final note, which 1466 00:46:13,020 --> 00:46:14,819 a lot of times the first question that 1467 00:46:14,820 --> 00:46:16,319 everybody's going to ask me. 1468 00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:18,749 I'm never going to preempt that by saying 1469 00:46:18,750 --> 00:46:20,609 that people ask me, Do I get hassled by 1470 00:46:20,610 --> 00:46:22,469 law enforcement intelligence agencies and 1471 00:46:22,470 --> 00:46:24,419 that sort of thing? I don't like talking 1472 00:46:24,420 --> 00:46:26,009 about that, and I don't like talking 1473 00:46:26,010 --> 00:46:27,989 about that because I fundamentally think 1474 00:46:27,990 --> 00:46:30,319 that these are civic institutions, 1475 00:46:30,320 --> 00:46:31,320 right? 1476 00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:32,560 That 1477 00:46:35,670 --> 00:46:37,199 I don't think that these guys who make 1478 00:46:37,200 --> 00:46:40,169 patches who say, let them fear, 1479 00:46:40,170 --> 00:46:41,999 let them hate as long as they fear, I 1480 00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:43,829 don't think they get to win. 1481 00:46:43,830 --> 00:46:45,989 Right? And I don't think that we 1482 00:46:45,990 --> 00:46:46,979 should have a attitude 1483 00:46:46,980 --> 00:46:48,419 towards these agencies. 1484 00:46:48,420 --> 00:46:49,589 I don't think we should live in fear of 1485 00:46:49,590 --> 00:46:50,590 them. 1486 00:46:55,980 --> 00:46:58,199 And so this is why I speak about 1487 00:46:58,200 --> 00:46:59,849 these projects in the way that I do, I'm 1488 00:46:59,850 --> 00:47:01,229 making fun of them. 1489 00:47:01,230 --> 00:47:03,239 You know, you laugh about them because I 1490 00:47:03,240 --> 00:47:05,309 don't think that that we're 1491 00:47:05,310 --> 00:47:05,969 going to do very 1492 00:47:05,970 --> 00:47:07,319 well for ourselves if we 1493 00:47:07,320 --> 00:47:08,999 participate in the culture of fear that 1494 00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:10,469 we have towards our own civic 1495 00:47:10,470 --> 00:47:12,149 institutions, which is ultimately what 1496 00:47:12,150 --> 00:47:13,150 this is all. 1497 00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:22,119 And I'll take any questions if anybody's 1498 00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:23,120 got something. 1499 00:47:28,350 --> 00:47:29,459 Hi. Hi, there. 1500 00:47:29,460 --> 00:47:31,139 Right. If you've got questions, can you 1501 00:47:31,140 --> 00:47:32,729 line up between the mike behind the 1502 00:47:32,730 --> 00:47:33,870 microphones in the aisles? 1503 00:47:35,160 --> 00:47:36,869 Do we have any questions from the 1504 00:47:36,870 --> 00:47:38,039 internet? 1505 00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:39,089 Yes, we do. 1506 00:47:39,090 --> 00:47:41,249 Go ahead. While we line them up here. 1507 00:47:47,930 --> 00:47:49,520 We'll take a question from the internet 1508 00:47:51,350 --> 00:47:53,059 on, OK? 1509 00:47:53,060 --> 00:47:54,979 There are two questions from the 1510 00:47:54,980 --> 00:47:57,049 internet. First one is, do 1511 00:47:57,050 --> 00:47:59,179 you know anything about underground 1512 00:47:59,180 --> 00:48:00,829 bases? 1513 00:48:00,830 --> 00:48:02,479 Do I know anything about underground 1514 00:48:02,480 --> 00:48:04,550 bases? Sure, this underground bases 1515 00:48:05,600 --> 00:48:06,679 there. 1516 00:48:06,680 --> 00:48:07,579 Yeah, there's 1517 00:48:07,580 --> 00:48:09,169 underground bases of places like the Blue 1518 00:48:09,170 --> 00:48:10,699 Cube at places like NASA. 1519 00:48:10,700 --> 00:48:11,700 Sure. 1520 00:48:12,110 --> 00:48:14,239 But if you're talking about, you know, 1521 00:48:14,240 --> 00:48:15,739 underground bases that are deep in the 1522 00:48:15,740 --> 00:48:17,059 desert, in the bottom of a mountain, 1523 00:48:17,060 --> 00:48:19,159 there's places like no rad, of course. 1524 00:48:19,160 --> 00:48:21,349 But but I don't think 1525 00:48:21,350 --> 00:48:23,419 that there's a big underground bases that 1526 00:48:23,420 --> 00:48:24,769 have no footprint that we don't know 1527 00:48:24,770 --> 00:48:25,770 about. 1528 00:48:26,540 --> 00:48:28,849 Again, the logistics are just 1529 00:48:28,850 --> 00:48:30,919 insane to, you know, think 1530 00:48:30,920 --> 00:48:31,920 about 1531 00:48:32,420 --> 00:48:34,159 what kind of trouble are we going to have 1532 00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:36,079 to call it? Let's face. 1533 00:48:36,080 --> 00:48:37,609 Unfortunately, everything starts to get a 1534 00:48:37,610 --> 00:48:39,059 bit full and we all over time. 1535 00:48:39,060 --> 00:48:41,149 So if you've got any questions 1536 00:48:41,150 --> 00:48:43,279 for Trevor Trevor, we'll be down in 1537 00:48:43,280 --> 00:48:44,449 the lounge, 1538 00:48:46,190 --> 00:48:47,810 at the bar, at the bar. 1539 00:48:49,490 --> 00:48:51,739 You can stalk Trevor in the bar, surveil 1540 00:48:51,740 --> 00:48:52,740 him.